The Dolphins Make Me Cry.com - Forums

This thread came from an evolution of another in the Off-Topic section, so I moved the idea here.

Basically, what do you feel JT's legacy should be with this team and how do you feel that his departure to the Jets should and will affect this?

Ring of Honor?  Number Retired?  Is it still up in the air?

Probably Ring of Honor + Number Retired after he retires from the NFL. It's too fresh right now and people will say how much they hate him now b/c he's with the Jets. After a while, people will reminisce.

I don't think what he did or does when he is in another uniform effects what he did when he was in a Dolphins uniform.  You can't just erase all the years and hard work because he is now wearing a color you hate.

I don't think it's enough to negate what he did here, but it certainly does affect it.  I think the Ring of Honor is more than just about your play on the field.  It's about building a legacy and history with the team.  I think that some of that is tarnished.

As more details come out about the contract and stuff like that + Taylor's performance with the Jets will make a big difference in how this is perceived over time.

I am reacting somewhere in the middle of the two extremes.  I don't fault him as much as some, but I hold no loyalty towards the player anymore.  I feel that he chose money over legacy.  That's fine -- it's his call and I may have done the same.   But he lost my undying loyalty from doing that.  I don't think I'll boo him, but I won't feel one bit of sadness for it.  Also, I won't give him an ovation when he returns.

Nothing he does with the Jets changes what he did as a Dolphin.  Just like Adam Vinitiri belongs in the Patriots hall of fame not withstanding his bolting to the Colts. 

It is still very fresh. Right now, I'm not Jason Taylor fan but I'm not sure I've bumped him off the Ring just yet. Afterall, Nick Buoniconti was a Patriot at one time although that situation is a bit different because he was a Pat first.

He should be remembered as one of the best players ever to play for the Dolphins 

Does Jerry Rice's time with the Raiders affect what he did as a 49er?

That's my answer to your question.

does thurman thomas' time with the dolphins affect his legacy?

just like johnny damon deserves to be honored by the red sox right .. after all he won the first championship in almost 100 years right ? ... right ... ?

I don't think his signing with the Jets should tarnish Taylor's reputation as a Dolphin at all. Now, if Miami had offered him a contract and he turned it down to sign with the Jets...I'd have a different opinion, but Miami made it pretty clear that they didn't want him here this season. I believe he is going in the NFL Hall of Fame after he retires, and I think he should also, at that time, receive every bit of respect that the Miami organization can provide, from the Ring of Honor to any other program or award they have in place.

I won't cheer for him while he's wearing a Jets uniform (duh), but I'll always be a huge Jason Taylor fan, and I refuse to let the business side of football dictate where my heart goes.

I honestly couldn't give two shits about Zach Thomas's,Jason Taylor's,or any former player's legacy.....I've never attended a game in Miami,so the ring doesn't mean squat to me.I really don't care if we retire their numbers or not....

In the other thread, someone said something along the lines of "we'll boo him because he's a Jets player and that's what we do". While it probably wasn't you, your comment got me thinking and I'll inappropriately reply here:

No, that's NOT what we do.

We don't boo PLAYERS. We boo TEAMS.

With certain exceptions, of course, but the general principle holds. Booing individual players just because they play for a team we hate is totally classless.

Giving JT a standing ovation on his first return to Miami would be the classy thing to do... followed by a solid booing of the Jets -- and a kicking of their collective asses.

Wow Dave, you're usually level headed about these issues. What about hios community work? Does putting on a Jets uniform negate that?

Give Jason his Just dues
But in no way should he make the ring of Honor It is Just that an Honor to be placed among those names and there is no Honor in what he did.
If all he wanted to do was play Im sure there would be teams outside the AFC east that would have shown an interest in him he decided to take the offer from NY which tells me he did it for more reasons then just to play he wants the chance to stick it to the front office of Miami and there is no Honor in that.
Living well is the best revenge

From all reports I saw, there really weren't any others, and certainly none that afforded him "one last shot" at a championship.


Judging a player based on what you "believe" to be his personal motivations is not only a good way to jump to an incorrect conclusion based on your own perspectives and predispositions, but a pretty harsh treatment of a player who has given a hell of a lot to this franchise and to the South FL community.

As far as what Jason's motivations might be, I'd like to offer an alternative to the "Buttfuck the Tuna" master plan you believe Jason to be working with. Let's just say that, imo, the last line of my first response above ("one last shot at a championship") seems more likely. He's a great player who's had a possible - but not 100% certain - hall of fame career. He knows he has to leave Miami, because Miami has done nothing but show him they didn't want him here. He looks around and says "OK, I want to play another year or two...let me reach out to teams that are playoff contenders, so I can have one last shot at a ring." He and his agent put out feelers, and the only team (or at least the only legit playoff contending team) that bites on Jason's hook is the Jets. He doesn't sign immediately, to give the Dolphins an opportunity to say "OK, we were just messin' around, come on back!"...but not a peep is heard from Ireland-Parcells-Sparano. 

I'm anything BUT happy that Jason is a Jet, trust me on this...but given the conditions surrounding his departure, I won't dog him at all for signing that deal.

So are you pulling Csonka out of the ring of honor too? He did leave the team for bigger money with the upstart league and then came back.

Sorry. Ring of honor is for a very special person. He is Rich enough to give up a 7.5 Million $$$ pay cut with the Redskins, he didn't need the $3 million handout from the Jets. Thats the one Team he shouldn't have went to. He ruined his own legacy by not thinking it out. Zach needs to come back.  Jason made his bed and now he can lie in it.

Csonka ?  Get this in your heads People!  He went to the JETS. The J-E-T-S , Jets.

Leaving my personal Bias out of this, how do we know this is a tabboo Team not to go too? Because Both Jason and Zack stated so. They both stated they hated NY and their fans on many occasions. They said they would NEVER go there. Zack lived up to it.   Fuck Jason Taylor. I will help Picket ANY decision to honor him as a Miami Dolphin in the future.  His pictures are gone from my garage, his photos are off my sons walls.

Rex Ryan set to to fuck Miami Dolphin fans and he succeeded.  I'm disappointed in the way this was handled by the Dolphins staff by letting it get this far, but ultimately it was Jason's decision. Hope you enjoy the $3 Million. It co$t you Alot more in my opinion.

That's interesting that you bring Csonka up because as I remember, Csonka, Kiick and Warfield blindsided the Dolphins by signing with the WFL. Shula didn't even know about it. On the other side of the coin, Joe Robbie didn't want to pay his players what they were worth. That transaction put a halt to the Miami Dolphins dynasty. The "Sea of Hands" game was the last game they played in together.

I think it was the first major case of free agency before the free agent period in NFL history. Pete Rozelle was livid but he couldn't do anything about it because it was another league. Football players are seen as contractors not full time employees like people think.

The guys from the defense started demanding more money. It was money that killed everything.

Yes, Csonka leaving in this Internet age would have been an outrage. He did come back in 1979 and won comeback player of the year and after the season, wanted a new contract but Robbie balked and he decided to retire.

Jason Taylor should go into the ring of honor and I hope he goes into the Hall of Fame. I think Marino is a key member on the Dolphins Alumni. If he is, Jason gets into the Ring of Fame. Jason patterned his community efforts after Marino.

That was about Money. Players made as much as Parking attendants back then,you can not blame someone doing what they needed to do to provide for their family.

Jason Taylor is so rich he gave up millions just not to partake in the offseason training in Washington. This was not about Money. Understand that. This was a big Fuck You , and people that say Fuck You shouldn't be able to be honored for life in the stadium they pissed on.

You know WHO DID do it for the money? Taylors agent. The same person who claims Miami didn't offer his client anything. he makes alot more money if his client signed with the Jets.

there is no excuse for going to the jets. i will hate on jt until he is off that God awful team.

(http://img688.imageshack.us/img688/3470/screenshot20100424at122.png)

i agree

Even after he is off. Do you welcome your wife back after she leaves your best friend and was fucking him for 2 yrs? No way. His ass is tainted now. He has the fireman Ed stench all over it. Come September he will come onto OUR field and look to inflict damage to us. To crush our layoff hopes and dreams. And to further the Jets. I can't and won't forgive that.

I'm as big a Dolphins fan as anyone else, but jeez some of you take things way too personal. 

You go live in NYC for 33 yrs and then tell me that. You have no Idea.

I lived here all my life.  When favorite Jim Edmonds ended up on the Cubs (he's now on the Brewers) because the Cardinals would not give him a decent offer, we cheered him when he came up to bat.  We still hate the Cubs more than anything (I think Lil B can attest to the level of hatred in this rivalry) but his was a business decision.  When he retires, the Cardinals will honor him, and rightfully so.

I see the Jason Taylor business pretty much the same way.  The vocal minority is just that, a minority.

Jason Taylors was NOT a business decision. the man talked about retirement 2 yrs ago. He walked away from millions because he didn't want to do Push ups in Washington. He has become a bit of a pampered Queen and Bill Parcells hates that shit.  Jason walks around crying about what he has done over and over. Great. But if you want to stay doing it, STFU and stand next to the Rookies and get dirty. Now you got Fat Bastard Rex Ryan who only wants to stick poke the Phins and their fans.  So after playing to Jasons inflated ego and telling him great he still is, he signs there. Fuck him.  Fuck him and his legacy. If he had an once of integrity he would stand by what he preached and never go near the dreaded Jets.

1. Show me direct quotes from Taylor being a "pampered Queen".
2. If he was so eager to F over the Dolphins, why did he wait so long to accept the Jets offer?


http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/rumors/post/Taylor-would-have-signed-with-Dolphins?urn=nfl,236235

Taylor would have signed with Dolphins

By Mark J. Miller


The Miami Dolphins are claiming that the team made an offer to linebacker Jason Taylor, but the linebacker's agent is saying that if the Dolphins had made even the hint of an actual offer, his client would have signed it, according to the New York Post.

Instead, Taylor has signed on with his former rival, the New York Jets, for the next two seasons.

"If there was an offer (from the Dolphins), I promise you he would have signed it last week," Taylor's agent said yesterday.

But there are reports that the Dolphins made an offer to Taylor last November that would have given him an $850,000 raise for one season.

none of that matters, he signed with the jets..

Can you get it through your thick head that no body else made him an offer?   I guess not.  Have fun wallowing in anger while the rest of us go on with our lives.

I don't have to show you shit. He refuses to do off season training with his team any more. thats the reason Parcells traded his ass in the first place. All he talks about is his past. Thats something you do when you retire. What are you going to do today!?


 
He wasn't eager. He wanted to be a Dolphin.  But he wanted it on his terms and the current organization does not play like that. I'm not exactly happy with them either. Signing Taylor just to keep him off the Jets is reason enough. But he did the unthinkable and I believe it should co$t him his legacy here. Thats the bottom line. Thats my opinion . Hopefully others as well. He ruined a great time in The Dolphins past for me. Fuck him and the sooner they assign #99 to someone else the sooner we can forget about him.

 

So the truth is out. Your hatred of a city and its millions of residents is now being directed at one human being who made a business decision and took a shot a attaining a level of acomplishment he has yet to be able to attain at his former employer.
So if he makes the HoF and his number is retired next too Zach's are you going to quit on the team?
What are you going to do if the Jets dominate the East for the next few years and win a SB or two like the Pats did?
With this level of hatred, how do you get enjoyment out of the game?

Do you understand what the word "voluntary" means?

If skipping the "voluntary" off-season activities result in you getting punished for missing them, why is the players' union giving up money for that feature?

I didn't know it was a secret? thats why I moved. I still see people from NYC and they High five me when they hear my accent. But I always say to myself, if you likd it so much why don't you move the fuck back?

I'll Never quit being a Dolphan. Where are you getting this from?  ??? But I'll boo his ass everytime he's mentioned at a game.  It is a pretty high level of hatred, I'll give you that. I get enjoyment because everyonce in a blue moon we get a game like last seasons Jet loss when Ginn ran 2 back to back. Thats why if you notice I have not been that hard on Ginn and I wish him luck. He gave me a great moment.

I'll never forget it. The Stat read  Dolphins 3rd quarter...........3 yds.  24 points. Rex Ryan shit himself. Also Ironically Jason taylors last great moment here.

Its a Prima Donna move. Show some fucking Leadership. Get down in the trenches with everyone else. Look at me, I'm JT , Look at how much I've acomplished. I don't have to do Push ups anymore. Fuck you you candy ass . Thats why Parcells doesn't respect him .

Once again: they are voluntary for a reason.  The players' union had to make concessions in order to receive that benefit.  And you want to demonize a player for not attending a voluntary offseason workout that conflicts with one of his other business interests?

I wonder: if that decision to skip voluntary OTAs was so upsetting to you, surely you can provide some evidence of you saying so before JT signed with the Jets?  Or is this simply naked, unrestrained hindsight revisionism?

Yep, that's the bet I was looking for on the board. Drop a dollar on the naked unrestrained hindsight revisionism horse for me, please.

Alays wondered why the Tuna seemed to have it in for him. I thought it was the Dancing with the stars bullshit maybe.  But his Prima Donna attitude is clearly why now.  And the way he visted with the Jets to show him was like a child throwing a tantrum. JT's ego had him believing that no way they would let him go there. I said the same thing as many others here did. Its just levrage to get Parcells to sign him before the draft. No way he wanted to go there. But he put himself in a situation he can't back out of. So fuck him. Him and his legacy.

You know, this whole Jason Taylor scenario was probably scripted by Vince McMahon...

A). Unkown defensive end gets drafted out of tiny Akron U. Becomes a well-known face (good guy). Known for his legendary sideline banter with Jet fans.

B). Develops swim (finishing) move for sacking QB's.

C.). At odds over what position he should play (character development) when new regime takes over. Leaves to go to another territory to wrassle. Seeks to be known in Hollywood as a Chippendales dancer. No more handing out beauty products in the locker room.

D). Comes back to the adoration of the fans (like Ric Flair unretiring for the 80th time).

E). Realizes that management doesn't want him to be a "star" anymore but wants him to be a jobber "scrub". Wishes that he would retire.

F). At the end of a glorius career, he turns "heel" much to the hatred of loyal fans like defense54. He is lustily booed from all corners of Dolphin nation. He enters the ring with green and white face paint.

G). Hires a manager (his brother in law, Zach Thomas) who was also, a beloved member of the Dolphins. His brother in law, to the press announces a New World Order of dominance by J.T.

H). He uses roughhouse tactics on Dolphin linemen and knocks Chad Henne into next week.

Vince could not have scripted it any better.

that was awesome.

Aaaanyway...back to JT's legacy:

Best defensive player in the franchise's history - locked up.
One of the best all-around guys in franchise history - locked up.
One of the hardest workers in franchise history - locked up.
Hall of Fame - likely, at some point (I don't think he's a first-ballot guy, yet).
Ring of Honor - likely-to-very probable, after the Tuna moves on, which could be imminent for all we know.

Only way he tarnishes his Miami legacy, for me, is if he wins the Super Bowl with the Jets.  IF this happens, Dolphins fans may never forgive him, because any memory of him will include him wearing a ring with the Jets logo on it.  IF he doesn't, well, Miami fans will come back to him, just as Bills fans still love Thurman Thomas, who played his final year in Miami (boy do Bills fans hate us), and Packers fans will one day love Brett Favre, and so on, and so on.

One final thing:  I love how so many here side with Parcells on the Tuna-Taylor deal, when the Tuna coached BOTH the Pats and Jets in the past.  If your hatred for him then can turn to love now, what's to say your current hatred for Taylor won't diminish with time once he comes back into the fold as an ambassador to the team?

When we have a front office as fucking retarded as this http://sports.espn.go.com/dallas/nfl/news/story?id=5140313 (http://sports.espn.go.com/dallas/nfl/news/story?id=5140313) how can you blame jason taylor.

^^^^ I agree completely. After the assinine question directed towards Dez by Ireland, I am inclined to believe JT's take on how things happened as opposed to the current regimes take.

So Your assuming everything. I am inclined though to believe Irlend is doing everything in his power to build us a championship Team. Fuck Jason Taylor and his feelings. Saying that to a Rookie ,( basically a kid) was wrong though. Looking into his family and upbringing is fine, but he didn't need to ask him something he already knew the answer to.

Fine you want play semantics. I am more inclined to believe the players side of it now that we have seen just how much of a tactless ass Ireland is.

Oh and you Never split hairs....... ::)

Again I do believe Ireland is doing everything in his power to build us the best team possible.  But he needs to start going about it better.  You don't want jason/ You think his precense is keeping Younger players from progressing?  Fine. Tell us that and Thank him for many yrs of great Play.  He needs to learn to play the Politically Correct part of the Game better.  Tactless Ass? Probably. But Nice guys finish last. I want a winning Team for a change.

So is every GM.  And a lot of GMs/coaches are dicks.   

The issue becomes is the GMs being dickish help or hurt the team.  I know with BB at times his arrogant dickishness has helped the Pats, at times it hurt the Pats. 

It seems that as of recent Irlend has done a bunch of unnecessarily dickish thing that are more likely to create a divide on the team than help it win championships.

I think alot of GM's, coaches would rather look good then do the harder thing to help the Team. I didn't want Zack or Jason to go , So I respected that. Its much harder to let guys like that go. But I agree, he needs to go about it better. the Tuna needs to straighten him out .