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http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/supreme-court-hear-gay-marriage-cases-201555862.html

My early prediction = split on the two cases.

They strike down DMA and require the feds to recoginize any state marriages. (pro-gay)

But say that gay marriage is not a fundemental right thus prop 8 is okay (anti-gay)

Leave open if CA (or other state without gay marriage) needs to recognize a lawful  gay marriage from another state.  They don't have to answer that question to decide these two cases.

The "full faith and credit" clause of the Constitution (which mandates that all states accept things like birth certificates as necessarily valid if they come from another state) will require the SCOTUS to rule on whether or not states are forced to recognize marriages performed in other states (part of DOMA).  If DOMA goes down, Prop. 8 becomes much less relevant; it just means that homosexuals will need to travel to SSM states to get married, which their home state will then be required to honor.

I agree with you that FF&C ought require that all states accept marriage certificates from all other states.  However, being neither of the cases in front of the court require such a ruling,I predict they sidestep the issue and rule on DOMA based on either conflicting with the 10th amendment or being valid under the supremecy clause. 

Couldn't that clause be used for legally obtained concealed weapons permits?

Which clause are you refering to?  - full faith and credit, supremecy, 10th amendment, equal protection.  Lots of clauses have been discussed in this thread.

I believe that those permits give you permission to carry a weapon in the state of [x].  In contrast, birth and marriage certificate are not "permission" as much as they are "recognition."  It's not like your marriage (or your birth) only exists in the state of Florida.

Those permits give you permission to conceal carry a firearm. Thirty five states have "recognition" reciprocity of a Florida CCW. And that's for concealed carry which is usually regulated. Some states allow open carry as a right without any licensing or permits either through legislation or by state constitutions.

Hypothetical.

New York like all states prohibits bigomy.  New York allows gay marriage. 

Florida doesn't recoginize gay marriage. 

Anne and Betty get married in NY.

They then move to Florida and break up.  Florida will not allow them to get a divorce b/c they don't recognize the marriage.

Betty meets Charlie and falls in love.  Florida doesn't recoginize Betty's prior marriage so they permit Betty and Charlie to marry in Florida.

Betty and Charlie move to New York.

Now what?  Does NY arrest Betty on Bigomy?  Not recoginze the Florida marriage? 

^^^ The local New York authorities should require Anne, Betty and Charlie to make a ménage à trois video.

Yeah, that's the ticket!

I would say bigamy. A fix would for them to just go to New York to get the divorce. It also wouldn't hurt to let Charlie know that she is gay before marrying him, lol. However that begs the question. If you're going to allow gay marriage. Why not bigamy ? Why not marrying your pet or farmyard animals ? Why not marrying your TV ?

in answer to your question (which i see alot from the anti-gay marriage crowd) .. in order:
yes,
no,
no

if you need me to elaborate on the whys, just let me know and i will

I'd be interested in hearing your position on bigamy...


I'm gonna go out on a limb and guess that you wouldn't marry a colored TV...

Yes, please elaborate.

I wouldn't say that I'm anti gay marriage. What a couple queers want to do with each other in private isn't my business. I'm kind of anti-marriage all together. I just don't get the big deal. If two people want to live together and be committed, do it. What does the marriage part have to do with it ? Why the big fuss over nothing ?

Then they never got a divorce decree, which means they are still married.  At this point, the rest is no different than if Betty went from NYC to Miami on spring break and got married to a guy.

All of this is no different than if a couple got straight married in, say, Cuba, then came to the U.S.  AFAIK, the only international treaty on marriage recognition is the 1978 Hague Convention on Marriages, and the only signatories to that treaty are Portugal, Luxembourg, Egypt, Australia, Finland and the Netherlands.

my position isn't on bigamy per-se .. or polygamy in general, but rather on consent.

If all parties consent, then i'm of the view that if the government should stay out of the business of prohibiting legal benefits for a pseudo- limited partnership between people.

I'm not arguing that it isn't a complex issue from a legal/tax standpoint, but as a base principle personal consent should trump accounting difficulties.

Also on a separate note, this type of derogatory language is not acceptable. I know you like to push buttons, a subtle dig here and a off-color comment there, and then toss in little bigoted digs, and dog whistles every once in a while. Then you feign surprise when your'e called out on it.

So i'm telling you as clearly as possible that this will not be tolerated. If you want to have a discussion on a topic cut this shit out. Act like an adult and we can all communicate properly. Consider this a warning.

Go get in a pissing match with someone else and harass them. Take your warning with you. Thank you and have a great day !!!!!

Are you really trying to test getting banned? I used to take up for you but it seems like you are purposely looking to join the few who have been sent to timeout.

Because I haven't done anything wrong, and yet you guys continue. You know what, fuck it. I'm not going to explain and try to justify every post I make to you people. God damn it, if you don't like what I have to say ignore it, get over it, or learn to live with it, because at this point. I don't give a shit. It seems to me that some of you guys are going to complain, bitch, and cry like little girls, regardless of what I say. So fuck it. If you want to fucking ban me so fucking bad, go ahead and fucking do it. And I'll just re register whenever I god damn well feel like it and continue where I left off.

For the record, it looks like the work QUEER is commonly used in the gay community, as seen below.

http://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_correctness (http://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_correctness)

Political correctness in sexual orientation

People who participate in a sexual relationship between 'men with men' or 'woman with woman' are commonly called "homosexual" or "Queer" and the PC words being "gay", or "lesbian" is used. The word "queer" is commonly used within the "gay community" to refer to others that are engaging in similar behavior.

badger6, you do understand that words that are used within a community to describe members of that community may not be considered appropriate for outsiders to use?

...wait, never mind.  I was going to cite another example, but I doubt it would help.

Banned.

Don't fuck with my mods.

...And the peasants rejoiced...

I agree.  This may be a sensitive subject so please don't be offended.  I hear my African American students call each other the "N" word all the time.  However, if a non African American person were to refer to them as that, they would get riled very easily (a couple have told me so).  In my class, I don't allow that word to be used, period. 

As an African American, do you feel the same way and have you personally ever used that term with other African Americans?



I don't rejoice over someone being banned.  This really disappoints me.  Badger was a good poster and generated a lot of discussion.  However, he was far too high strung and always had to be right.  He would constantly attack people who had different opinions.  God forbid someone should prove him wrong. 

(http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m41a8wsSoE1r7z57y.gif)

Tax deductions. :x

And adding each other onto their work benefits.  Many large corporations now have the "domestic partnership" option for homosexual couples.  However, in order to stay within federal guidelines of gender equality, they have to allow it for heterosexual couples as well.

And there are all kinds of legal, medical, and inheritance issues involved also.  As an example the other week on the tv show the Good Wife, a wife doesn't have to testify against her husband, but a gay partner would be required to testify.

Then there is always let gay people get married and have to suffer through divorce like the rest of the population.   :)

There should be no boon to getting married over being single, other than the enjoyment of spending your life with someone who makes you happy.
As a single person I hate the tax deductions married couple get over single people.

FF&C. I am not sure though based on the public policy exception the SCOTUS has crafted seperate from what the Constitution says.

I think Spider covered it.  CCW permit gives you permission to do something very specific in one state, not unlike a fishing permit.  A birth certficate or marriage licenses defines who you are. 

Depending on the two people's respective income some times it is boom, some times they pay more taxes by getting married. 

 

And the results are.....

NY case -- strike down DOMA.  If the state recognizes the marriage so will the feds. But no requirement that states recognized gay marriage. 

punt on the CA case....lack of standing.

good results all around

punting the CA case means basically that prop 8 is overturned and that the district court ruling that it is unconstitutional stands as the law

I'm very Happy for my gay friends,unfortunately I'm not sure how much it's going to change here...Missouri has a state DOMA in place,which at the moment complicates things...

Immidiately, gays that get married in an equal rights state get federal benefits even if they move to Missouri .. regardless of what missouri wants or doesn't.

In the long term the case precedent and text of the decision on DOMA can be and will be used by people in missouri to sue the state on equal protection grounds to get those laws overturned.

Hmm, so does this mean gay married couples can file joint tax returns??

yes

Anything that knocks a brick out of our country's wall of ignorance is a good thing, so I'm happy to hear this news...