The Dolphins Make Me Cry.com - Forums

Ok, I wasnt going to bring this up, but I decided to after my blood boiled a few times.

Dateline, February 14, 2006, 6:00 AM...

We get a phone call from a friend of Ms Frimp. Seems that this guy, we'll call him "X" commited suicide either late on Feb 13 or very early Feb 14.

Ms Frimp took the call, and bolted back to Newberry, SC to be there for his family, as well as his friends.

I have no problem whatsoever with that.

What I DO have a problem with is that "X" commited suicide. Nevermind the fact that it was Valentine's day, and Ms Frimp and I had VERY nice plans to spend our first Valentine's Day together.

X comited suicide. All of his friends and family were devestated, and rightfully so, but what they dont realize is that commiting suicide is the most selfish act that anyone could ever do.

X had friends and family that would have been more than happy to talk to him if he was feeling down. He knew this, but rather than trying to help himself, he decided to keep his problems bottled up, and more or less guarantee that for one day, everyone who was close to him would be totally devoted to him.

Well, he got what he wanted. Everything that he spelled out in his suicide note will be taking place. The Newberry Jaycees will be "honorary pallbearers" and the songs he wanted will be played at his funeral.

I obviously didnt go with Ms Frimp. I didnt know the guy, and even if I did, I still wouldnt have gone. This guy doesnt deserve the honor that he demanded in his suicide note. I would feel the same way if it was my own family member. Whoever is in charge of his funeral arrangements should have him cremated and then throw the urn in the trash.

Suicide is a coward's escape from whatever the problem is. All you accomplish by commiting suicide is to hurt the people who are close to you and make them anguish over what they could have done, and ask themselves over and over again why they didnt see the signs.

I just wish that the people who were close to X could just realize that this whole thing was planned, and see him for what he truly is. Nothing but a selfish peice of crap, and most certainly, nothing to lose any sleep over.

The only thing I'm losing sleep over is losing my first Valentine's day with Ms Frimp. After a long conversation with her on the phone, she also sees him for what he was. A worthless selfish prick.

By committing suicide, you only hurt the people you claim to love, and prove that you dont love them.

It's pretty pointless to try to apply logic to an illogical act.

Because if you commit suicide, you're obviously acting illogical.

Suicide = A permanent solution to a temporary problem.

Frimp,  THANK YOU. (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v693/lordthundergod/notworthy.gif)(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v693/lordthundergod/eusa_clap.gif)

I couldn't have said it any better myself. I don't feel sorry for anyone who does it.  I feel sorry for the families.

Suicide can be completely logical. If the rest of your life is going to suck, why go through with it? Of course you can't predict your own future exactly, but you can estimate.

It's true that the more friends and family you have that care about you, the more selfish it would be. But some people really have no one that cares about them -- it might even be part of the reason they want to kill themselves in the first place. Plus, sometimes considering friends and family can cut the other way. Have you ever known someone with really advanced Alzheimer's disease?

Uh-oh, a medical query.  Yes, medical.

Maine - 13 years old.  Hearing noises in the kitchen at 4am.  I get up at 5am to deliver papers anyway, so I open the door to my room that connects with said kitchen.  Maine's Dad is laying on the floor, in a pool of blood.  He spent the night popping pills and chasing them with whiskey.  His body gave out, he fell over and hit his head on the way down.  He lived and, from that point, started to battle his demons.

There are two types of suicide attempts documented by doctors, my Dad attempted what is known as a "call."  On a sub conscience level he really didn't want to die, although he was feeling that way.  Those suicide attempts are often not realized.  Then there are the people that toss themselves off the Golden Gate bridge or put a gun to their head.  Those are the "lost causes."  No stopping that run away train.

A lost cause feels things a little differently than you or I.  There might be some mis-firing in their brain, there might be chemical addictions - something off.  The lives that they live don't feel worth living and no amount of "you've got it good, smarten up" talks will help.  These people are depressed on a clinical and severe level, a level that most medical professionals barely understand.  It's a depression that goes beyond being sad, it's a depression that literally feels like an extra 100 pounds on your soul.

I'm not saying that taking your life is a noble thing, but I also wouldn't say that someone is selfish for doing it.  A person that succeeds in killing themselves is someone that, for whatever reason or another, can't fathom waking up one more day. 

When you think about it - most of us are scared of dying.  That's why you get nervous when someone cuts you off in traffic, it's why you go to the doctor's for physicals, it's why chest pains frighten you.  The thought of NOT waking up tomorrow will keep you from sleeping.  This guy could not stomach another day amoung the living.

In a world with medications to cure discoloration of the toe nails and such, I find it sad that we can't connect the dots to figure out clinical depression.  Anyone that is wired differently to an extent of bucking nature, and every human's deepest fear, is someone that I pity.  I'm glad that my father has been able to fight his personal demons.

I can't say that anyone who commits suicide is a coward.  I don't understand depression.  I've never experienced it beyond "bummer, I got an F on my calculus test." (In other words, I've never experienced it).  Is it the easy way out and all that?  Yeah, probably.  The thing is, I can think about the concept rationally, whereas someone with clinical depression or bipolar disorder may not.

This is exactly what I mean.  Unless you happen to be a prisoner that being tortured (or some other similar situation where death is a very likely outcome in the immediate future, and the only thing you can look forward to between now and death is more torture), it's illogical to believe that the rest of your existence will be so horrible that death would be preferable.

This excludes people with terminal illness, who I assume are outside the scope of Frimp's original post.  I don't really consider that "suicide" in the sense that we are talking about.  There actually is solid logic behind euthanasia at that point.

But as Maine said, there are people who are mentally ill and cannot evaluate their situations rationally.  It is useless to try to argue logic with someone that isn't making a decision based on logic.

Frimp,

I'm not taking a stab, but I'm wondering if you'd feel differently on ths subject if it was someone close to you, perhaps a sibling, who was "Mr. X".

I have a feeling this thread is going to get uncivilized soon...  I hope I'm wrong.

Who here hasn't fantasized (more so when I was younger) about committing suicide after someone close "wrongs" us and then pictured them next to the grave sobbing cause it was all their fault.

It's a common fantasy. However, it's also a big leap from that to reality.

Never, man.  I think differently, I guess.  When wronged, I never think "you'll be sorry when I'm dead", I think more like "You'll be sorry in 10 years when I'm uber-successful and you need my help, and I remind you of this day as I laugh at your request."  Wanting to die just never enters into my mind, which is why I said I can't pass judgement on someone who chooses that route.  I've never felt anything remotely like what "X" must have felt.

Suicide is a complicated act done for many reasons.  Depression is a sickness, and losing the battle is just like falling to any other disease.  I've lost a friend to suicide.  As much as it hurt me, I'm sure the process was much more painful for him.

Frimp, by mindful that everyone doesn't think like you.  You're thinking of suicide from your stable mental state.  I'm sure that X was experiencing emotions that you have never imagined.

I can't even comment on this.   :(

You and I think about this the same way.

Brian, I didnt start this thread to start a fight. I just needed to blow off some steam.

Me either...this thread hits way too close to home, and I worry that I'll lose my cool and piss off some people that I consider friends. For some unfathomable reason, I keep coming back to read it though.

Gotta agree with Sunstroke on this one.  Philly, too. 

I think it's important to remember that Frimp's opinion and feelings are just as valid as anyone else's.  Most of us have been touched by this subject, so it will be a sticky one to delve into.

I personally will leave it at this:  I personally wish everyone a calm soul.  A lot to ask, yes, but that's my wish.

I know you didn't.  I was worried about something else...

Its a complicated subject, which different people experience in different ways.  I just didn't want all those differences to clash and create a firestorm, that's all.

I'm with Maine on this one, and the rest of the people who've felt the complicated repercussions of the act of suicide. One of the most interesting cases of suicide that I've read about is the case of R. Budd Dwyer. Have any of your heard of him? If you haven't then read this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budd_Dwyer

Certainly an interesting, tragic act. Alot of art has dealt with it too. Romeo and Juliet, Madame Bovary, the Faerie Queene, etc. Also, cultures deal with it differently. In feudal Japan, if what I've read is trustworthy, commiting suicide because you disgraced yourself (and family) was one of the only honorable paths you could take. Seems strange to us, but I'm sure our view on it would be the same to them.

It's impossible really, from my viewpoint to say, "in conclusion" about suicide. It's a terrible, terrible thing. I wish it was impossible, but then again, I wish all the complicated sets of difficulties and feelings leading up to it were impossible too. God bless ya all. I hope you never have to deal with it.


I hope the steam is blown off, sir. I know how aggravating it can be. My thoughts and prayers are with you, your significant other, and then man's family...

It's fine, we can discuss this without fighting.

Spider-Dan, you seem to acknowledge that for someone who's going to be tortured, suicide is logical. Why is that the only case? Many people are lonely and have no one to care about them; many people are terminally ill; many people just do not get pleasure out of living; their daily routines are depressing burdens. Why is it illogical for these people to continue on?

I personally feel that survival is pretty much hard-coded into our makeup.  When this is lost, something is wrong.  I don't think we choose to live each day based on logic.  It's instinct.

Just because something isn't hard-coded into your nature doesn't mean it's illogical.

Specifically, because these people have a relatively high chance of being killed.  Most people who are willing to torture are also quite willing to murder.  If you are in a situation where you are subject to repeated torture, the situation is quite literally out of your control at that point, and could remain so for the rest of your (short) life.

Excluding the terminally ill (who I already addressed), it's not illogical for the others to continue on.  Assuming that the person is middle-aged or younger, it's ridiculously unlikely that the next 20+ years of your life will be the same as they are now.  You have an extremely long period of time in which your life can change.