The Dolphins Make Me Cry.com - Forums

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Hilarious!!!!!

Disagree.  I find it in poor taste.

And I don't give a flying fuck how poor that taste is.  This guy is a juicer, plain and simple.  He's about to break one of baseball's most hallowed records, and the majority of sports fans feel he doesn't deserve it.  Hammerin Hank worked very hard to set that record.  I'd hate to see it get broken by a cheater.    He deserves whatever he gets. 

I'm just brutally honest and tell it like it is. 

Two things:

1. He's a good 40+ HR's away from breaking that record.  He may not get there!
2. I'm sure Bonds coulnd't give 1 shit about the majority of fans who feel as if he didn't deserve it.  Not the same situation, but the majority of fans didn't want Roger Maris to break Babe Ruth's record either, so much in fact that baseball attached a stupid asterisk next to his record for 30 years.

Poor taste in using someone starving as the butt of your joke, I guess you never thought about that or cared as to why I thought it was in poor taste.

I do not give a flying flip about Bonds.

Did Maris use 'roids?  No, he worked hard to get that single-season record.  He did it naturally and he did it fair and square.  Only to see it broken three times by juicers. 

Why is everyone picking on Bonds?  Everyone was on roids at the time.  Baseball is to blame...not Bonds.  They turned a blind eye to it, because Barry and Sosa were lifting their sport again.

Agreed Dave. Baseball caused this mess going all the way to the candy bowls filled with uppers during the '70s. I don't like Bonds, but it is because he is a prick.

Baseball's integrity went out the window years ago.

I will pick on Bonds constantly and anyone else who refuses to admit their guilt. He is scum. Look at Jason Giambi as an example. That is a man who stepped up and admitted his guilt and he is still loved.

Good point Denver. Another good example is Conseco. Now that his stories are vidicated he is looked at more favorably than he was when his book came out.

On the flip side McGwire was a beloved athlete until that "testimony". Honesty is all these guys need in order to gain redemption from most of America.

Conseco took a HUGE AMOUNT of crap from members on this board.  They called him a money grubbing, sellout, backstabber.  He helped bring out the problem into the limelight.

I think that there are tons of guys who don't admit it, but the media isn't all over them because they aren't chasing a home-run record.  Barry is a liar just like the rest of baseball.  The worst thing about Barry is that he's so good, that all eyes are on him.

Baseball screwed up by allowing this kind of thing to happen.  It's not Barry's cross to bear.  We all know he did it (and everyone else), but he never got caught.  ...so baseball just has to deal with their tarnished history, because they allowed it to happen.

If another player soon gets close to 61 Homeruns, I think you will see a media fury and the reaction will be like he IS the new HR king. I would like that as long it's from a guy who no one really looks at and says "Juice".

Mac was in a no win situation.  Most have already came to the conclusion he used, so let suppose he didn't.  What good would it have done to say he didn't?   Would it have change the people who believe he used minds?  No.
Why would he admit to usage if he really didn't?  So the best play if he didn't use was to not address it.

We already know he used Andro which is the closes thing to a roid without being one, so why should we question if he used anything else?  The usage of Andro is enough to muscle him up.  I want to add Andro was perfectly legal supplement then.   

 Just look a Sammy. In those same hearing ( Which were nothing but Gov camera seeking, but that's another thread )  He flat out said he did not use.  How many believed him?  Same would have been the same with Mac, so why even address it?

The only thing they could have said was "I used" in order to make most of the public happy.

Frankly I believe Mac until proven otherwise.   I know he used Andro & I know the affects of Andro.

To be honest, I really do not care if these guys used.  If they are willing to risk their life for a few more Hrs, then why should I care?

They turned a blind eye, because fans were not showing up.  It was 4 years after the '94 strike & fans were still staying away. 

Mac & Sammy put people back in the seats.  Baseball cashed in.

Frankly, I cannot believe fans actually go to baseball games & with the prices they want, but a duck & his money will soon part.

Sure Bonds was caught. He was accused in a grand jury of having taken steroids. A book just came out detailing Bonds' steroid use very carefully. Everyone in their right minds, as you point out, knows he did it. So how was he not caught?

Find one single drug test where he tested positive.  You're talking about circumstancial evidence, hearsay, and suspicion.

Being accused & someone writting a book does not mean he was caught.  Just someone trying to cash in on it.

So you guys are not sure that Bonds has taken steroids? Wow. You are very naive.

No, I'm just saying you have no positive proof.

You have alot of circumstancial suspicion.  You have no confession and nothing rock solid.  There is still reasonable doubt.

Try to get that to pass any jury.

Who gives a shit about reasonable doubt? This isn't a criminal trial. The question is whether he's been "caught." If you are trying to do something in secret, but now everyone knows that you've done it, you've been caught. It doesn't matter how people found out, or what the penalties are.

When was he caught?   Did they catch him with a needle in his arm?  Did he test positive for it?  Just how was he caught?

The only thing positive you have is conjecture.

Where you are confused is no one knows for sure he did it.  We can speculate that he has but in the end we only have an opinion.

I believe Bonds did it.   I have zero proof other than my opinion. 

There's testimony from the guy's personal trainer that he gave Bonds steroids. That isn't conjecture. It's direct evidence.

Can you provide evidence as to the validity of the trainer's argument?  How do you know he's not lying...?

This is the court of public opinion.  There are other ways to build muscle mass and bulk up over 20 YEARS.  (you do realize 1986 was 20 years ago, right?)

You don't gain 20lbs of muscle at the age of 37 in an offseason. Ask any gymrat.

That is not evidence.   Evidence is a failed test.   Evidence is catching him while making the purchase.

That is just someone saying he did it.    How good is this man credibility?   Is the man lying?  Does he have something to gain by lying?   Did he say Bonds knew what he was giving him? 

Like I said.  I think he did it, but as of right now.  No proof.

hear·say 
n.

   1. Unverified information heard or received from another; rumor.
   2. Law. Evidence based on the reports of others rather than the personal knowledge of a witness and therefore generally not admissible as testimony.

Um, the testimony of a person saying "I gave Bonds steroids" is not hearsay. Check your definition.

I got it straight from dictionary.com - I didn't make it up.

I don't know the trainer from a hole in the wall.  The guy could certainly have made up a bunch of lies to (a) get a book deal and (b) get a bunch of notariety.  Any time money is involved you must question the validity of the source.  It certainly wouldn't be the first time someone lied in public to get rich quick...

I'm not questioning your definition, I'm saying just read it. The statement "I gave Bonds steroids" is drawn from the personal knowledge of the witness, so it falls outside the definition of hearsay.

If you decide not to credit this evidence, that's one thing. But that's not to say that it's not evidence.

In any event there's much more evidence besides this guy's testimony. There's the dramatic change in Bonds' body shape. Look how big his head is and fat his face is! There's also his sudden transformation from a balanced power/speed guy to a meathead slugger in a very short period of time. The guy had never hit 50 homers in a season, then he hits 73? There's also the reports of many major league players that steroid use is rampant in baseball. And then there are all the detailed allegations in the book. It's just sticking your head in the sand to say "there is no evidence" about Bonds' steroid use.

If you're not convinced, fine. I think that's naive and reflects an inexplicable desire to defend not just a steroid user but an incorrigible asshole. But it is definitely ridiculous to say there is no evidence on Bonds and steroids.

Don't get me wrong, I think Bonds is a scumbag and should be expelled from the sport, but without "catching him in the act" by failing a test, confession, or some other type of indisputable evidence, there's nothing MLB can do.

I don't doubt he juiced, I'm just arguing that all the "evidence" is merely public suspicion based on the several valid points you've mentioned.

You guys that are saying Bonds never failed a test, therefore he is not guilty need to take into account what baseball's testing policy was previously. It's hard to fail a test when you are not asked to piss.

Yes, that's true, but since they've started testing, he's been tested and passed.