The Dolphins Make Me Cry.com - Forums

Word is coach isn't happy that he has no desire to learn the playbook. As well, although Brain Flores said everyone was starting with a clean sheet it doesn't take much to link in Jone's refusal to go back into the game last season with his absence around the Dolphins facility and NOT being a team player. This situation will quickly show what kind of coach Flores intends to be as "the Patriot way" is all about the team being bigger than the player.

https://www.miamiherald.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/barry-jackson/article229734919.html

So why are the Dolphins willing to trade him? Because of age (31) and salary and the determination he’s likely not a longterm piece. And though they would never admit this publicly, the Dolphins have told people that the new regime was very unhappy that Jones refused to go back in the Jets game last November after being told earlier in the week that he would not be playing every snap but instead used in a rotation.

That type of behavior would be unacceptable to new coach Brian Flores, who values putting the team well above anything else. Jones’ decision to stay away from the team’s voluntary offseason practices also runs counter to Flores’ team-first approach. Jones is the only player who isn’t attending OTAs.

The key component of all that is whether or not the "not part of the team's long term plans" statement is true.  If he truly is not part of the team's long term plans, then they should trade him as long as they get at least a decent return on their investment.  This is not going to be a one or two year rebuild.  So anyone over 30 who can get a decent return to the team via trade should be on the trading block.  By the time that the Dolphins are ready to be a playoff contender, Jones will be in the decline of his career. 

At this point, what's he worth?

Whatever he's worth, you take it.   The Bucs made a big mistake not trading G-Mac before they released him.   Thankfully, they picked up Suh to replace him.   

How much is another team going to give you for a guy that isn’t a team player, has a huge salary and is on the wrong side of 30? 

That's the biggest issue I see too. Depending on how much they want to jettison him we will find out what we are willing to give up to get rid of him. He's a good player but if he's going to be a cancer to others who are trying then the team may make any deal.

Unless I missed something, he didn't seem to be a problem in previous seasons. Wonder what happened to him. Seems we've had this type of thing happen to some of our good players going all the way back to the Philbin regime.

I agree that they probably wouldn't get much in return.  But if he isn't in their long range plans, they would probably be happy to get at least something in return for him while dumping salary.  The same way the traded Tanny and Quinn and didn't get much in return.  But at least they got something and dumped salary in the process. 

He's not the same player the last 2 years after coming back from injury. He's still good, but he's not the same.

Although they were all informed earlier that week, he refused to go back in and play against the Jets because they rotated him out in the first half. He didn't play one snap of the second half because he was pouting.

Yeah, I remember but that seems to be when it all started. I don't recall any issues before that happened. Something else could have happened behind the scenes. We'll probably never know either way.

I don't think that would really be an issue if had showed up to OTAs.  Different coach.  If he showed up to OTAs with a positive attitude, odds are Flores would be like, "I don't know what happened between you and Gase, and I don't care, the past is the past.  As long as you give 100% this season I don't give two shits what happened last year." 

Problem is he is still pouting about last year, this year. 

A coach may say that but he will likely consider it a first strike if the player doesn't show a change. 

Not a Philbin Gase Flores guy.

Again, not promising when your new head coach's early moves are to get rid of your team's best players.  Why not do your job and coach them?

A prerequisite to that is for the player to actually show up and be coached. The only real leverage a coach has is to get rid of players who are unwilling to participate.

This is all speculation.  I'd bet he'll be there for mandatory training camp.

It's the coach's responsibility to hold players accountable so if Flores wants only team first players then he has every right to do so. It's not like he hasn't said that from day one andI can assure you it's been vocalized a lot more to the team itself. The Le'Veon Belll's of the world can find many teams to play on but New England isn't going to be one of them. It doesn't appear Miami will be either.

One the problems that has plagued Miami for years is lack of accountablity on the part of players. I'm all for getting rid of players that don't put in the effort. Jones is just the latest to put himself before the team and it's showed. The problem is that they also let guys like Jarvis Landry go when he clearly put in the work, they just didn't want to pay him. Those guys I miss. I think they made a HUGE mistake letting Jarvis Landry go to Cleveland.

It does seem that way as of now. Omar said this morning that they tried to get rid and were not successful so it looks as if he will be here.

Adam Beasley reported ... Dolphins coach Brian Flores told reporters that Jones showed up “in really good shape.”

“I’m really looking forward to working with him,” Flores continued. “He was excited to get into meetings and practice.”

While he is not apart of our or any other team's long term future plans, I feel that he would be very attractive to a contender whose need is safety. Especially, if we eat half his salary to get a better draft pick in return.

Anything we get is better than nothing.

^If we do trade him, I'd prefer it be right before or during the season, when a team is more desperate.

I'm tired of coaches who refuse to coach and instead want to just get rid of the top talent on the team.  Getting rid of a player requires exactly zero coaching ability.

Seems to me that poor player development and/or lack of talent have been much larger problems plaguing the team.

I'm not sure how successful you've been at coaching but there is no "coaching" a narcissistic person into being a team player. They either are or they aren't. Typically they are best used as bad examples and getting rid of them is one way of doing that.

It's a 2 way street. The entire coaching staff has been changed multiple times. I don't see any reason that players should be given a pass on the same fate. You don't produce, we'll find someone who will.

I think you can affect a narcissistic player.  For example Randy Moss in New England.  But too be successful you can’t give in to the player or any player.  And you have to have something they want. 

Trading Jones is in essence coaching the rest of the team.

As I see it, one of the reasons Bill Belichick has been successful is that he has been able to take "selfish, uncoachable" players like Corey Dillon or Randy Moss and get through to them.

To switch sports, one of the reasons Phil Jackson is an all-time great is because he doesn't show up and immediately decide to get rid of the team's best players; he gets through to them and gets them to buy in.

Then why have these coaches gotten rid of the best producing players on the team?  You wouldn't hear anything from me if they were trying to trade DeVante Parker.

It seems to me that this is less about getting rid of bad apples, and more about a procession of coaches walking in the door and declaring, "These aren't my guys."

Yep, my gut says he won't be in Dolphins colors sometime before the season is out (if not the entire season).

That run in at the Jets game leading to preseason rumblings combined with his massive salary has sealed his fate. Despite the recent positive spin I reckon we will shop him around, either that or a team thinking they are a Superbowl chance with him as a need comes knocking on the door and we will move him on quicker than you can say "for a 6th rounder?"

Put it this way, I reckon there's a good reason the throwback jerseys pictured so far this year feature Stills, Minkah & Howard, and not Rehsad. I reckon Nike must still be seething at all those Tannehill, Suh and Ajayi jerseys they made and then had to dump... they were all team MVPs, not that it stopped them from being traded/cut.

Lol .... Randy Moss is a perfect example. He chose to drop his attitude to be a team player on a great team. It happened "before" he was signed and not afterwards. Unless BB has some kind of Jedi mind tricks to change them before he coaches them then he wasn't coached into being a team player. hahahaha

This is another case of players changing their attitude and buying into Phil. Phil got respect with Michael Jordon so other attitude players believed in him before he coached them. It's not like they were asses under him and he somehow made them see the light. 

BB was able to get Moss to buy in large part because of his willingness to part ways/bench players who didn’t follow the script.

BB traded away the second greatest wr in the history of the NFL two years after setting record for most TD receptions.

Demoted to back up league leader in receptions for making a snow angle.

Did the samething for making foot jokes.

Benched the starting safety in the SB for still unknown reasons. 

But DeVante Parker is as much of the problem if not a bigger part of the problem. Too many guys with talent coming out of college or in free agency don't seem to produce. You're putting that on the Dolphins coaching staff which I agree they are partly to blame, but some of the blame needs to go on DeVante Parker for not being able to reach his potential. Both the coaching staff and the players need to be held accountable, not just the coaching staff. Same thing goes for players that get traded or leave in free agency, some of that is on them because winning is the goal and there hasn't been enough of that in Miami. They need to take some blame for that as well, it's not just all on the coaching staff. I haven't really seen a long list of guys leaving Miami for other teams and suddenly turning around their fortunes elsewhere. There's a couple, but the list isn't long.

So what you're basically saying is that while BB is a great coach, at the same time he's a fucking asshole too, LMFAO....

I don't know about that. There are plenty of examples of mediocre players going to other teams and doing better. Current staff withstanding, previous coaching staffs in Miami don't exactly have stellar reputations. Isn't it the running joke that when we release or trade someone that they go somewhere else in the AFCE and continue to haunt us for years and years?

Same could be said about previous Bucs coaching staffs.   Darelle Revis, LeGarrette Blount, Adrian Clayborn, Mark Barron, Aquib Talib..... shall I go on?

It's a Florida thing, haha.

What you are trying to say is that Belichick talked with Moss and got him to buy in, where other coaches tried the same thing and could not.  That is the textbook definition of good coaching, and you seem to believe it's laughable.

How did Phil get Jordan to respect him after Doug Collins was fired?
How did Phil get Shaq and Kobe to buy in when other coaches (like Jeff Van Gundy) were saying the only reason Phil ever had any success was because Jordan landed in his lap?
Getting good players to "change their attitude" is exactly what Flores and his predecessors refuse to do.  That's the point!

Again, these are TEXTBOOK examples of coaches convincing players to buy in.  Brian Flores has a Super Bowl ring as a safety coach, and he can't figure out how to get through to a safety and convince him that things will be different?  Or is it that he doesn't think it's even worth it to try?

I've said it before: the only thing Belichick seems to teach his coaching staff is how to be haughty assholes.  He definitely teaches them the part about trading away Moss and benching Welker or Butler to prove how much of a hardass you are, yet he never seems to teach them the part about getting Dillon or Moss or Revis to buy in to your program.