The Dolphins Make Me Cry.com - Forums

Minkah Fitzpatrick asked for and received permission from the Fins to seek a trade.  I knew he was a quality player coming out of college but as I stated here after that draft, I was against the Fins taking him because they had so many pressing needs in other areas and there was really no place to put him in the secondary.  But I feel bad for the guy because they have never given him a specific role.  They have moved him around pretty much everywhere except Nose Tackle.  It is hard for anyone to flourish like that, especially a really young guy like him.  The Fins have essentially never really given him a chance to excel.  And if they do trade him, they are getting nowhere near what they spent on him.  He was the 11th pick in the First Round.  They will get MAYBE a 3rd rounder for him. 

As I understand it ... after making several comments to the press he was brought into the office to discuss his criticisms of the coaching staff. During this meeting he was asked several times if he was the one wanting to leave to which he never admitted he was. It was then said to him that if he wanted to leave feel free to have his agent seek a trade but they weren't giving him up cheap.

The hope is that he and coach work it out but it sounds like they aren't letting him go for less than a 1st round pick. That wouldn't go over too well with Ross considering he wanted to pass on Minkah and select Lamar Jackson.

I don't see them getting "significant" return for him. Omar called him out in the preseason practices and everyone thought he was just being Omar. Turns out Minkah hasn't been playing well.

Omar Kelly
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I don’t want to be the bearer of bad news, but Minkah Fitzpatrick isn’t playing well.

8:17 AM - 14 Aug 2019

I thought he was such a high character guy, but playing poorly and requesting a trade in your 2nd season is terrible behavior.

I agree with Miami on this though, do not give him away for anything other than an equal value 1st rounder. Not like he is some bust with a year left on his rookie deal, this is a high legit 1st round player.

The thing is though that when a player doesn't want to be on a team, they usually don't stay on the team for very long.  Teams consider it "bad for the locker room" to have someone in it that doesn't want to be there.  So the Fins can publicly say all they want about how they want multiple high round picks for him.  When push comes to shove, the team will take what it can get for him if the situation starts to become a distraction to the team. 

Normally I would agree, but not for a guy they just spent a 1st rounder on making cheap money. They will either play him or bench him until his attitude changes before they except a 3rd rounder for him. Like I said, this isn't some kid in the lats year of a rookie deal. He has 4 years of team control left. If the team that offers a 1st rounder is going to have one in the high 20's, they'll probably be asked to throw in a 4th rounder as well. This management team has done well so far with trading players, I doubt they will let him dictate the situation for them.

Miami hasn’t been exactly fair with him. First rounders typically get to prove themselves in a single position rather than need to learn multiple positions and never get to truly develop.  

And Minka requested a trade.  He has not taken a play out of the Antonio Brown playbook for forcing a trade.

This sucks. Is he the first of a few that are going to start looking to jump ship?
You can't put draft picks on the field. You need actual human football players.

Yeah, we definitely are not doing the kid any favors with how he has been handled. If a trade doesn't come, it is in both parties best interests to lock him down for ONE position and play him there. It's pointless to not make a very talented player happy and even more pointless to turn a 1st rounder into a 3rd rounder in a year. I think this blows over when no suitable offers come in and the team works this out. Young, cheap and talented are exactly the type of player that a rebuilding team needs.

Two ... count them ... two different staffs have not been able to find a spot for him. Sooner or later you have to ask yourself if you’re the problem.

This is from May:

“We’re going to move guys around,” Flores said. “It may look like he’s playing corner, he’s playing safety, he could be playing linebacker. It depends. I’ll know what he’s doing. You guys probably won’t.”

As a rookie last season, the former Alabama All-American started five games at safety, three at cornerback and three at nickel back. He was one of the five Miami defensive backs who started at least 11 games in 2018 (and none started more than 14).

Personally, I think they should play him at one position (whatever they may be) let him grow into it and go from there. I think the Dolphins brass is expecting hm to be a jack of all trades, and frankly, it may be too much on his plate.  That doesn't anything bad about the kid, but it's alot IMO

I think the issue is that he is very talented so while he can handle different positions, he can't handle different positions within the same quarter. He graded out amazing as a slot corner last year, so let him play slot corner. Every single team is going o be calling us, that should tell the organization something.

If we can't get at least a 2nd and a 3rd for a very good young first round DB, then I say don't deal him...

The dolphins should play to his strengths. He's a smallish type finesse player, he doesn't need LB or in the box responsibilities on a consistent basis. While I'm sure he could to some extent, you don't see Brady out there punting the ball or long snapping? Everyone on the team should have their job clearly defined.

You don't flex 1st round draft pick all over the defense. Maybe down the road when he's got a few years under his belt and he's ready for it. But Flores is being stupid. And by watching his press conferences, he seems to be a cocky dickhead like Gase was. 

Minkah Fitzpatrick: I’m focused on Patriots, not a trade.

Supposedly he has a much larger role in this week's game. I guess we will see how it goes on Sunday.

Flores said he wasn’t irritated that Fitzpatrick would ask for a trade and praised him, saying: “He’s done a really good job all week. This is a tough kid, a hardworking kid. He loves football. I expect him to play well Sunday. He’s going to be a big part of the game plan.

“I’ve had this kind of similar situation and others in the past, so I think we’ll be able to move past it and move through it. I think as an organization, we’ll be fine.”

I wouldn't trade him for anything but what we paid for him. This isn't a Josh Rosen where he played poorly and we wanted his replacement badly. Minkah did very well and we don't need to trade him at all. Unless some team comes in with a Tunsil offer, we should keep him and work things out. We aren't being fair to him with multiple positions.

How many first-round selections will we have to throw in the trash to get an early pick next year?  Seems like the answer is at least two.

And this is what happens when a team decides to tank for the next 2-3 seasons.

Here’s an awful question that no one has asked. What if our first rounders refuse to sign and demand a trade (ala Elway or Eli) because of the tanking situation?

Wha?!!! You're joking right?

How about playing him out of position, trading away both the starting and backup DE's on BOTH sides of the line so he'll have to cover for 10 seconds and basically telling him we are forfeiting your 2nd year in the league so we can get a high draft choice and draft a QB. If that means trading you to move up or get more draft choices we'll do that too meaning you will be starting over with a new team your third year in the league. What about THAT? THAT'S FUCKING TERRIBLE BEHAVIOR! What Minka did was a have normal reaction to that behavior.

Mirrors my thoughts, man this sucks.

I thought Minkah may have been one of the few guys who could be still on our list when we eventually make the payoffs again (along with Howard, maybe Drake) and soon be one of the leaders on defense that was envisioned when he was drafted...

Is this the first stage of the players mutiny mentioned that could happen when Tunsil was traded?


Minkah better be prepared because I reckon Brady will throw the ball a lot in his direction. McCain was exposed so badly last week by the play action pass, you can expect a lot more of that coming too.

If I'm Licht, I'll offer a third plus Justin Evans or Carlton Davis

NFL Network says he can be traded this week.

I still think it is a mistake. He is very talented and cheap for 4 years. You rebuild around these guys. You don't turn #11 overall picks into late 1st rounders, that's how you fail long term.

The kid shouldn't turn around and run away but we did screw him over too. Both sides need to work this out because Minkah needs to realize that he is going to the team with the best trade package. If that's another garbage squad like the Giants, then so be it.

Intentionally deciding not to compete is never the solution.

I still don't understand why people are happy about dismantling a below-average team on the hopes that maybe MIA will draft a savior.

We just want Tua since he appears to be a legit franchise QB and not just the first QB taken off the board by a needy team.

I have accepted 0-16 but my idea wasn't to dismantle the squad this badly. I am very against trading Minkah.

Is Tua even a better prospect than Trevor Lawrence?

IND drafted back-to-back stone-cold lock prospects.  Peyton gave them 1 SB win and one more appearance.  Luck gave them 1 AFCCG loss.  These are the best results tanking has provided in NFL history.

Maybe they can trade him to a team the Patriots will play in the playoffs, like they did Ajayi.

Maybe then, Miami can help derail New England again.

And as long as I'm dreaming, I'd like an end to Global Warming.

Just a heads up ... the Dolphins have never said they wanted Tua. Any suggestion to that fact is purely speculative.  

Of course not, it hurts leverage in case they want to make a trade. I can't recall any team that ever said they wanted to draft a certain player during the season, let alone before it.

It's just obvious that we need a franchise QB and will very likely be in a position to acquire one.

I think that they wait a year and draft Lawrence, unless the ownership panics and orders Tua next year.

Again, the question is...what if top draft choices refuse to play for this organization?

They will never refuse to not make millions of dollars as the #1 overall pick. They would sign with a team after next year's draft but they won't go #1 again. Maybe no even in the first round due to character concerns.

Minkah traded to Pittsburgh for 2020 1st round pick.

This might make for the best trade. With Big Ben out, this might end up being a Top 10 pick.

Still, I'm guessing that Christian Wilkins is now on the trade block as well.

Well, I wanted to replace the #11 overall pick we used for him and unless their backup QB pulls a Tom Brady, that seems likely to happen.

I still wanted to keep him but we got value in return and now have 3 first rounders in 2020. Don't need them for ammo to move up to #1 overall either since we are an insult to God.

This is why I say that I am fine with this season because we have so many high draft picks and cap space that I would be surprised if we don't win at least 6 games next season and then push for the division the following year. Brady can't last forever.......right?

My guess is that by the time this team is a contender again (which is 2-3 years away), he'll be at the end of his rookie contract and they'll have to pay him big bucks




And Houston didn't look too good on Sunday, struggling to beat a lowly Jaguars team.   There's a good chance you guys will end up with three top ten picks.  The question is, do you grab Tua or rebuild your trenches and see what Rosen can do, then go after Lawrence in 2021?

Lawrence would be the #1 pick in 2021, so we have no shot at him unless we trade away all of our 2020 draft picks for 2021 draft picks and basically own the Top 15 picks. That's unlikely so they will still draft Tua (as of now) and build the team from there.

It's entirely possible Rosen starts a bunch next season too just to have Tua learn a bit on the sidelines. And, "God forbid" Rosen does very well then we have some decisions to make on trades and whatnot.

Also, the Texans will be fine. They have no one in their division, so it's more likely they get a 1st round bye than it is they are a Bottom 10 team.

Seems like the Fins got more for Minkah than I thought they would.  Especially with Big Ben being out now.  I heard something on the radio about the Fins also gave their 2020 4th round pick to Pittsburgh for their 2020 5th round pick.  Not sure if I heard that correctly, but if so, then it wasn't a straight up Minkah for Pittsburgh's 1st rounder.  The Fins will have also essentially dropped down a round from 4th to 5th .   

Over the weekend, I heard some guy on ESPN say that the Dolphins record was now 0 and Tua.   I thought that was pretty funny. 

With all the QBs getting injured already this year, I'm kind of surprised that they aren't trying to also trade Ryan Fitzpatrick and get some kind of draft capital in return.  Not sure how much they would get for him, but not much point in keeping him on the roster this year. 

@MiamiDolphins half an hour ago:
"We have acquired a 2020 first-round pick, a 2020 fifth-round pick and a 2021 sixth-round pick from Pittsburgh in exchange for safety Minkah Fitzpatrick, a 2020 fourth-round pick and a 2021 seventh-round pick."

I expected a first rounder because they did not have to trade him. Plus, Minkah is very talented and under team control for 4 years. Anything less than what appears to be a Top 15 pick would've been a bad move by our organization.

Move can look even better if this is a Top 10 pick.

This would be my choice but I think after this season they are going to be forced to grab a QB just to try and put butts back in the seats.

Talk about making things overly complicated for no reason.  Just do the first round pick.  No reason to complicate things by trading the other 4 picks.

that probably came from Pittsburgh

Teams do this all the time. Probably someone sitting with a copy of The Chart and a spreadsheet.

Yeah, to sell it to their fanbase for when they hand over the #6 overall pick to Miami.

Funny story as told by Chris Grier. He stated they walked away but Texas kept coming back so they had laid out the conditions and wrote them on the board in his office. He said when he called Tunsil into his office to discuss the trade that Tunsil saw the board and said something to the effect "wow ... I'd trade myself for that too".

Patriots went 11-5 without Brady in 2008

They went 3-1 without Brady in 2016

When Brady retires, it's not going be much easier to challenge New England 

It's a quality system in place, but they won't be the same team and I'm pretty sure Belichick is leaving when Brady does. He's got his rings and why tarnish his legacy just in case he goes 4-12 without Brady?

I hate seeing the wheels come off my team like this. I’ve never seen them so bad, or so hopeless. Even that 1-15 team was a better gem than this, and I don’t remember feeling like those guys didn’t want to be there, or had given up. This team has already given up.

Honestly, when Brady retires, I might ACTUALLY start rooting for the Patriots on the side                   

That’s a big statement man. Better watch what you say around these parts.

Actually I doubt that statement really surprises anyone here.

I don't even hate the Patriots. We have fielded like 3 competitive teams since Brady joined the league, we have no right to hate them since our incompetence is a good part of their success. We, along with the other 2 failure franchises are a big reason why they get 1st Round byes almost every year.

I hate us more than the Patriots.

Only because he's still in denial

Their success is theirs alone.

The majority definitely is, but you can't just discard having NO competition within your own division for nearly 20 years. Those 12-4 records with a 1st round bye could've been 10-6 records and a Wild Card if any of the teams were competitive more than once a decade. We won 10 or more games 3 times since 2002. Bills have 0 seasons of 10 wins or more and the Jets have 4. That's not competition.

That discounts the fact NE has a higher win % against non-AFCE teams than vs AFCE teams.

I'm not saying that they haven't earned their rings, but it certainly would've been a lot harder for them if Miami or Buffalo pulled out a few 12 win seasons here and there to win the division and knocked the Pats down to the Wild Card.

Yeah and I guess the fact that Miami, Buffalo and the Jets have had to play the Patriots twice a year has had nothing whatsoever to do with their lack of success over the last 20 years? Brady/Belichick have been unbeatable in Foxboro during that span, so essentially Miami, Buffalo and Jets started every year 0-1. Can you name any other franchise that has had this problem?

I am not an Armando Salguero (Miami Herald) fan at all.  But he has a very good article today about how the Cowboy game was the worst game of the year so far for the Fins.  He made some really good points, including this one that gives me a lot of concern and touches on points I have made here about how much of a disservice the Fins do to Fitzpatrick and the team by having him play practically every position but Nose Tackle.  Most of us knew that Minkah would excel and be an outstanding player when he left Miami.  This quote from Salguero's article jumped out at me (and I watched the Steelers game and Minkah played really well the whole game).

"Fitzpatrick, playing safety for a team he’s practiced with only three times, had an interception, a quarterback hit, a pass defensed, and he forced a fumble. He generally played the way the Dolphins told us he’d play when he was drafted by them with the No. 11 overall selection in 2018.

Except he didn’t play like that in Miami. And under this coaching staff, he hated being with Miami because he wanted to play a position or two and this staff stubbornly wanted him to play four or more and that caused him to ask to be traded."

Yeah, we really didn't do a great job with Minkah, but you still don't request a trade after your 17th career game.

He will make the Pro Bowl this year for the 4 win Steelers.

I think Minkah will do well but it was only one game. I wouldn't put him in the HOF just yet. He did get embarrassingly slammed on a big play too.

https://www.49ers.com/video/49ers-kyle-juszczyk-minkah-fitzpatrick

This isn't the first time you see a former Dolphin (or Buc) flourishing with another team.   And I'm damn sure it won't be the last.   What is it about the state of Florida that causes pro football teams to underachieve??

Miami is getting ready to become the worst sports town in history. The Marlins just lost 100 games (again), the Heat and Panthers didn't make the playoffs and the Dolphins very well may go 0-16.

He was right to demand a trade.  His success (or lack of) will set the price of his next contract. 

 

This is what worries me about Flores. Everyone is giving the coach a pass on the season because they are rebuilding, but his treatment of Minkah in particular does not bode well. You have to put your players into positions to succeed. You can't fit a round peg into a square hole. Minkah had a good season last year. Why mess with a good thing? That shows an inability to adapt to the players you have and rather trying to force them into "your system". I'm not encouraged by what I have see so far from Flores.

Every player has good and bad plays.  You can make a lengthy video highlighting all the interceptions Arron Rodgers has thrown in his career if you want to find bad plays.  And you can make a Mark Sanchez highlight video that would make him look like a hall of famer.

Question isn’t can I find a video of one play.  Did he play better on his new team.  

So the bad play doesn't matter but the two good plays he made do? Hahaha No.... you're not biased. The bottom line is it was only one game. Dante Culpepper scored 5 TDs against Miami but sucked after that.

Look ... I think it sucks we lost him but the jury about how well it worked out for either is yet to be seen.

Minkah is going to be a stud...regardless of who he plays for...

Overall he had a better game for the Steelers than he had for Miami.  Despite only limited knowledge of the system.

The big question regarding the sustainability of that is how much of that was the fact the 49rs didn’t know how the Steelers would use him.  He wasn’t part of the film study of the prior two weeks games.

He also got a gift INT. It's not like he beat someone to get it.