Facts and Myths of the Dolphins upcoming draft.........

[Philly Fin Fan]

Let's see theres
Troy Akins, Joe Montana, Steve Young, Breet Farve, Tom Brady, Payton Manning,Terry Bradshaw, Roger Staubauch, John Elway, who in the hell need's a franchise qb like the ones I mentioned ?

First thing, learn the names of the QBs if you are going to list them.
Secondly- a "franchise QB" can be found lots of places. 3 of the QBs you listed were traded from the teams that drafted them.


For the record-
Manning, Bradshaw, Aikman and Elway were first overall.
Young was a supplemental draft pick.
Montana was a 3rd rounder,  Staubach was a 10th rounder, Favre was a 2nd rounder, and Brady was a 6th rounder.
Young, Favre, and Elway were traded away from the teams that drafted them.

[bsfins]

Let's see theres
Troy Akins, Joe Montana, Steve Young, Breet Farve, Tom Brady, Payton Manning,Terry Bradshaw, Roger Staubauch, John Elway, who in the hell need's a franchise qb like the ones I mentioned ?

We all know your man love for Matt Ryan...but your reasons why we need to draft him with the first overall pick...lack merit....

Of those guy's you mentioned...Where they were drafted....

Troy Aikman (I'm assuming you don't mean Akins???) 1st pick over all....I guess Emmit,and that massive line had nothing to do with it...

Steve young 1st round Supplemental draft
Joe Montana 3rd round pick
Brett Farve  2nd round pick
Tom brady 6th round pick
Peyton Manning 1st over all pick
Roger Staubach 10th round pick
Terry Bradshaw 1st over all pick Great defensive team that ran the ball,had great Wr's when they did Throw
John Elway 1st overall pick....How many tries did he need to win the superbowl,ohh wait didn't win till he got T.Davis.

Franchise QB's aren't always the first round picks....

How about
Johnny Unitas 9th round pick
Norman Van Brocklin 4th round pick
Fran Tarkenton 3rd rounder
Bart Starr 17th round
Y.A. Tittle 1st round
Dan Fouts 3rd round


Oops..Sorry didn't know Philly was doing the same research that I was...

[JonBGoode]

20 million under the cap...  I wish I had a better understanding of how good or bad this is.  I am happy they explained the cap number for Russell, but I still don't really have a feel for what kind of money it would take to sign everyone from this draft.

I wish I knew some sort of average (and maybe the high and low) of what cap money was spent for last years draft class.  You have to assume that this year would be a little higher the way trends have gone.

Normally 20 million in Cap would be good to have but this year picking at #1, unless we can trade out, means that we have to be able to take on the hit of drafting at #1. this means that you will have to have room to take on a 35 million $ hit over 5/6 years. The bonus alone is about 7 Million a year plus salary just for the one guy and we will have 8-10 other picks which will add to that figure. We also need to have money for needs during the year to be able to sign players if needed. Last year we set aside about 7 mil to sign the whole draft class so you can see the difference it makes.

[fyo]

Last year we set aside about 7 mil to sign the whole draft class so you can see the difference it makes.

I think you've misunderstood a few things in this regard.

The NFL has a fixed rookie cap, sometimes also referred to as the rookie pool. The amount varies from team to team, depending on number of draft picks and where those picks fall in the the draft. Last year, our rookie cap was $5.367 million dollars.

No team is allowed to spend more than the rookie cap in aggregate cap space on their draft picks and other rookie signings combined.

The Raiders had the largest rookie cap last year, $6.913 million (11 draft picks, including the #1 overall). It stands to reason that Miami probably has pretty much the same amount available this year. It might be as high as $7.5 million, but that's as high as I can see it go.

In other words, rookie contracts are not a problem in terms of 2008 cap space.

[Defense54]

^ I agree with you, I just don't think Ryan is the guy we are looking for.  Maybe we can find a gem in the later rounds, or next year will have a better QB pool.

I'm not sold on Ryan and for the record I don't think Parcells is either. He's trying to pump up interest for that #1 spot. I'm holding out hope for Colt Brennan in the later rounds but he does not fit Parcells profile for a QB at all.  But unless Beck did something Horribly wrong.........and I don't see anywhere where he did, We won't be taking a QB in the 1st round. But taking some insurance on day 2 would be wise.

[bsmooth]

I'm not sold on Ryan and for the record I don't think Parcells is either. He's trying to pump up interest for that #1 spot. I'm holding out hope for Colt Brennan in the later rounds but he does not fit Parcells profile for a QB at all.  But unless Beck did something Horribly wrong.........and I don't see anywhere where he did, We won't be taking a QB in the 1st round. But taking some insurance on day 2 would be wise.

From what I read it did not sound as if Colt did well enough at the combines to get rid of the tag he earned in college by playing in an ungodly weak conference that his team could not even dominate while racking up those crazy stats.

[Defense54]

From what I read it did not sound as if Colt did well enough at the combines to get rid of the tag he earned in college by playing in an ungodly weak conference that his team could not even dominate while racking up those crazy stats.

I still think he's got a Razor arm. I mean you could say the same thing about Dan Marino ........His teams never dominated while racking up the best stats in the Buisness. Maybe he will fall into the 4th or 5th round. No way he goes any further then that. I'd love to see him picked up by us on the 2nd day to compete with Beck for that #2 spot.

[Matt McGuire]

Parcells is a little overrated in the draft imo. He passed up on the most legit LT prospect ever (the big bust being Mandarich) in Orlando Pace for just 3rd and 4th round picks...traded again because he didn't like Walter Jones.

Both where future HOFers. I consider Parcells that year to make one of the worst decisions with the #1 pick. With the way scouting has changed today, there is no way you can mess up that badly again and lose that much value in the Draft.

FACT: Chris Long is a lock at #1.

[Sunstroke]

Good to see you up here, Matt...

I am not quite ready to admit that Chris Long is a lock yet, but all evidence is certainly pointing that way. As long as we get a top shelf OT in round two, I guess I'm ok with it, but I think that Jake Long is going to end up outplaying a lot of touts' expectations by the time it's done.

[Defense54]

Parcells is a little overrated in the draft imo. He passed up on the most legit LT prospect ever (the big bust being Mandarich) in Orlando Pace for just 3rd and 4th round picks...traded again because he didn't like Walter Jones.

Both where future HOFers. I consider Parcells that year to make one of the worst decisions with the #1 pick. With the way scouting has changed today, there is no way you can mess up that badly again and lose that much value in the Draft.

FACT: Chris Long is a lock at #1.

No doubt Parcells ain't perfect.  Nobody is. The draft is such a gamble that in my eyes as long as you are successful 50% of the time your the goods. I mean out of say 10 Picks you hit on 5 players that are still on the rooster after 3 years.  Looking at Miami's draft record the past 10 yrs........50% is a HUGE upgrade.

[Blue4me]

No doubt Parcells ain't perfect.  Nobody is. The draft is such a gamble that in my eyes as long as you are successful 50% of the time your the goods. I mean out of say 10 Picks you hit on 5 players that are still on the rooster after 3 years.  Looking at Miami's draft record the past 10 yrs........50% is a HUGE upgrade.

How true. Growing up near Chicago as a Bears fan, we always pointed to the 1983 draft as the huge draft that made the 1985 team what it was.

Round 1   #6     Jimbo Covert - OT
Round 1   #18   Willie Gault - WR
Round 2   #33   Mike Richardson - CB
Round 3   #64   Dave Duerson - S
Round 4   #91   Tom Thayer - G
Round 4   #107 Pat Dunsmore - TE
Round 8   #203 Richard Dent - DE
Round 8   #219 Mark Bortz - G
Round 9   #230 Rob Fada - G
Round 9   #235 Mark Zavagnin - LB
Round 10 #245 Anthony Hutchinson -RB
Round 11 #286 Gary Worthy - RB
Round 12 #313 Oliver Williams - WR

You could argue they hit on 7 picks (Covert, Gault, Richardson, Duerson, Thayer, Bortz and Dent), with the remaining 5 as busts. The 7 hits were all instrumental winning the Super Bowl in the '85 season.

What is interesting is the Bears drafted their QB (McMahon) the previous year (Rd. #1, pick #5) and then built the core of the O-line in this draft. So much for the argument of not drafting a QB without a decent O-line in place. (Matt Ryan argument!)

They also drafted a LT (Covert) with the first pick. (Hello Jake Long?)

But their Super Bowl MVP was a DE, Richard Dent, but not picked until Rd. 6. We know Chris Long will not drop until Rd. 6!

My official prediction is Chris Long will be the pick. He is the closest thing to a lock and we cannot have another Rd. 1 bust.  They will look further down for a LT and a QB to challenge John Beck. I think Beck can be an effective game manager, but not a Pro-Bowler. Parcells will look for an insurance QB later down the draft.

[fyo]

You could argue they hit on 7 picks (Covert, Gault, Richardson, Duerson, Thayer, Bortz and Dent), with the remaining 5 as busts.

So they hit on their top 4 picks? That's pretty much perfect.

Calling the remaining 5, drafted mid-4th and down, busts is ridiculous. You can't be a bust if you were drafted in the fourth round, much less the 12th.

[Blue4me]

So they hit on their top 4 picks? That's pretty much perfect.

Calling the remaining 5, drafted mid-4th and down, busts is ridiculous. You can't be a bust if you were drafted in the fourth round, much less the 12th.

You're right. "bust" is not the right word. They hit a few home runs in that draft. Getting Dent late was the clincher.

The point is the Dolphins don't have to hit a home run with every pick, but they DO need to hit a few in this draft. 50% would be welcome!

[bsfins]

^ It's hard to "hit" when you change coaches,and philosphies,and direction every year or two..... But that's another arguement...

[doctord56]

How true. Growing up near Chicago as a Bears fan, we always pointed to the 1983 draft as the huge draft that made the 1985 team what it was.

Given Blue's comments, I looked back at dolphin history for the best top to bottom draft in history. I'd have to say 1970 fits the bill, especially if you count trading the first pick for HOF player Paul Warfield.

1st round--trade for Paul Warfield
2nd round-Jim Mandich
3rd round-Tim Foley
4th-Curtis johnson
7th-Jake Scott
9th-Hubert Ginn
12th-Mike Kolen

The players drafted in the 6th, 8th, 10th, 11th, and 13th-17th round did not make the team. The 5th round pick was traded as part of the deal for a guy named Buoniconti, who joined the team the year before--not a bad pickup.

Out of this draft they acquired a world class wide receiver by trade, a starting TE, three fourths of their starting defensive backfield including a future superbowl MVP, a starting OLB (Kolen), and last and least a special teamer (Ginn).  Six of the guys who made the roster were major contributors to the great dolphin teams of the early 70's. Curtis johnson played for 9 seasons, Tim Foley for 11 (one pro bowl), Kolen for 8 seasons, Mandich for 8..overall, the best top to bottom draft in team history. To add to the embarrasment of riches, they added as free agents Doug Swift (starting OLB for 6 years) and future HOF center Jim Langer. GM Joe Thomas kicked ass that year.

Other really good years for three or more impact/solid starter level players:
1968-Csonka, Dick Anderson, Jim Kiick
1969-Bill Stanfill, Bob Heinz, Merc, lloyd Mumphord
1980-Don McNeal, Dwight Stevenson, David Woodley
1983-Marino, Reggie Roby, Mark Clayton

And that's about it.....note no draft with three impact players/solid starters  in 25 years. In 1997 they drafted Sam Madison and Jason taylor, but I don't count Derick Rodgers (drafted third round that year) as anything but a journeyman.