Ginn at #9..............the worst pick of the decade?

[Sunstroke]

It does not matter if Ginn becomes the next Jerry Rice while Quinn becomes the next Brian Leaf

I hear that Chekovi Ellsbury and Brian Leaf like to go bowling together in the offseason...

[Dphins4me]

You can say whatever you want to about Cam Cameron & Co...........but THAT is the # 1 reason why he was not given a second season. It does not matter if Ginn becomes the next Jerry Rice while Quinn becomes the next Brian ( Ryan ) Leaf. The fact is you just DON"T take chances like that in your first NFL draft. It was as irresponsible as much as it was disheartening to every Fan who wanted someone and something to believe in.  Not his fault that he was picked #9. Unfortunately , Ginn will have to deal with that for some time to come.

That makes no dang sense.   If Ginn becomes the next Rice & Quinn is a bust then it was a bad pick?   That is great scouting & great confidence in your ability to judge talent.

   It would have been a bigger chance drafting Quinn at No. 9 simply because he was deemed not worthy of being a top 15 pick, top 20 pick.  Franchise Qbs. are not located at the bottom of the top ten.  They go top 5 at worst, usually higher.  I cannot understand why you actually want a man who is running the team to listen to what fans want.  Fans are generally ignorant, because they think if they read a Sporting New draft preview mag that they know which player will be worthy.  ( They had Beau Bell as a 1st Rder & he went in Rd. 4 & Aundrae Allison last year as a 1st Rder & he went in Rd. 5 )  The fact you think Miami should have drafted a player in the top ten when it took a team trading back into Rd. 1 near the bottom of the Rd. to draft him.  Had Cleveland waited Quinn would have fell even further.  Quinn was closer to dropping out of Rd. 1 than he was to Miami's No. 9 pick.  That should tell you everything you need to know about what the NFL thought of his ability & make this issue dead.  His ability was questioned & the fact Cam & Company knew that & knew Miami fans wanted Quinn & still did not take him shows they knew what they were doing.

If Miami had the QBs rated & I will used a scale from 1 to 100. 

Russell - 94
Quinn - 90
Beck - 89
Stanton - 88

& had the Wr rated
Johnson -  98
Ginn - 94
Bowe - 91

Then why would you draft Quinn at No. 9 if the Qb you had rated next was only one point behind & figure getting him in Rd. 2 was highly possible, then why would you draft a lesser player?   BTW Beck is very capable of being a franchise Qb.   

 Why are Miami fans not upset that Miami passed on Ryan for Long?  Was it because Ryan was not media hyped like Quinn was?  or is it because the man Miami fans consider holy was behind the decision?

[fyo]

Ginn has the potential to be a decent slot receiver and a very good kick returner, but those positions are ones you take later in the draft. Not in the top-10.

SLOT receiver? No, not the way the slot is played in the NFL, he doesn't. He's not nearly physical enough for that. He also wouldn't be able to utilize his speed, running mostly hooks, in-routes and the like.

No, if you don't like Ginn, say he has the potential to become a very good #2 receiver. That would make sense. A slot receiver he ain't.

(Oh, and several teams have spent first round picks on SLOT receivers in the past few years... players who specifically played that position in college).

[Dphins4me]

A team coming off a 6-10 season takes a kick returner in the first round over a potential franchise QB??  WTF??

  Only fans thought Quinn was a franchise Qb, the men who do it for a living had questions about him.    Tell me when is the last time a Qb who was considered a sure franchise Qb got drafted at the bottom of Rd. 1?  The fact is & it is a fact.  There were & are serious questions about Quinn's ability.

Ginn is not a kick returner.  He is Miami's No. 1 Wr. 

( For your Info )  Tim Brown was drafted top 10 ( 6th )  & he was their kick returner his first year & several years after that, so yes you do pick Wr who return kicks in the top 10.

[Sunstroke]

SLOT receiver? No, not the way the slot is played in the NFL, he doesn't.

Yes...the way the slot is played in the NFL.

Ginn could technically become a decent #2 WR in the same way he can become a decent slot WR. Question is, which of the following is a good choice at #9 overall?

A) A good slot WR
B) A good #2 WR
C) None of the above

(The answer is C, of course)

[Rick]

  Only fans thought Quinn was a franchise Qb, the men who do it for a living had questions about him.    Tell me when is the last time a Qb who was considered a sure franchise Qb got drafted at the bottom of Rd. 1?  The fact is & it is a fact.  There were & are serious questions about Quinn's ability.

Ginn is not a kick returner.  He is Miami's No. 1 Wr. 

( For your Info )  Tim Brown was drafted top 10 ( 6th )  & he was their kick returner his first year & several years after that, so yes you do pick Wr who return kicks in the top 10.

  Alot of the experts had Brady Quinn at the top of their draft boards.  He was even projected to be picked #1 by the Raiders by some draft guru's.  He fell to the end of round 1 because after Camoron's blown pick at #9, teams picking 10 and after really had more pressing needs then QB.  Brady Quinn will be a solid QB in the NFL for years to come.
     
   Tim Brown had proven himself in college to be a good WIDE RECIEVER/KR.   Tedd Ginn was picked for his speed and KR.  Ginn was a reach for a team anywhere in the top 20. 
 
    Stroke is right on with his assesment of Ginn, becoming a good slot WR or possibly a # 2 WR ( maybe) but I highly doubt Ginn will ever be Miami's #1 WR. 
   

[simeon]

  Alot of the experts had Brady Quinn at the top of their draft boards.  He was even projected to be picked #1 by the Raiders by some draft guru's.  He fell to the end of round 1 because after Camoron's blown pick at #9, teams picking 10 and after really had more pressing needs then QB.  Brady Quinn will be a solid QB in the NFL for years to come.
     
   Tim Brown had proven himself in college to be a good WIDE RECIEVER/KR.   Tedd Ginn was picked for his speed and KR.  Ginn was a reach for a team anywhere in the top 20. 
 
    Stroke is right on with his assesment of Ginn, becoming a good slot WR or possibly a # 2 WR ( maybe) but I highly doubt Ginn will ever be Miami's #1 WR. 
   

How do you know Quinn will be a solid QB in years to come ? If so why did Cleveland elect to resign Anderson ? Quinn has yet to prove himself, and barring any injuries that chance wont come for a long time.Yes Ginn was a reach at the #9, yes it was a throw away pick. The fact is most people see Ginn as no more then a #2 receiver is scary but then again Cameron still haunts us, question who is our #1 WR  right now , that is scary.

[Dphins4me]

  Alot of the experts had Brady Quinn at the top of their draft boards. 

Are these experts ( Tounge in cheek ) working in the NFL or playing fantasy NFL GM?  BTW there is no such thing as an expert when it comes to projecting how player will do taking the next step up.

He was even projected to be picked #1 by the Raiders by some draft guru's.

  Only the ones that know little about football.

  He fell to the end of round 1 because after Camoron's blown pick at #9, teams picking 10 and after really had more pressing needs then QB.  Brady Quinn will be a solid QB in the NFL for years to come..

Quinn might be a solid QB.  Then again he might be a total flop.  We do not know.

So you are trying to tell me that a Qb who was projected to be the No .1 pick of the draft fell all the way to No. 22 because Cam & Comp did not pick him at No. 9?  Since when do teams pass on franchise Qbs for other positions?  Since when do teams at No. 9 get a shot at franchise Qbs?

   Tim Brown had proven himself in college to be a good WIDE RECIEVER/KR.   Tedd Ginn was picked for his speed and KR.  Ginn was a reach for a team anywhere in the top 20. 

Coming into the NFL is about predicting where a player will ascend to.  Houston reportedly was set to draft Ginn at No. 10.    Brown was more proven in college, but was still more of a returner at that time. 

 

    Stroke is right on with his assesment of Ginn, becoming a good slot WR or possibly a # 2 WR ( maybe) but I highly doubt Ginn will ever be Miami's #1 WR. 

  You believe him to be correct.  He might actually not be.  No one thought Steve Smith would be the Wr he is & I think its safe to say he is Car. No. 1.

Ginn is Miami's No. 1 this year.

[Sunstroke]

You believe him to be correct.  He might actually not be.  No one thought Steve Smith would be the Wr he is & I think its safe to say he is Car. No. 1.

Ginn is Miami's No. 1 this year.

You're right...I could be off. So could you. Thus is the glory and agony of prognostication, and the folly of believing that anyone can accurately predict the future every time.

That said, you've casually thrown Steve Smith and Jerry Rice in the same conversation as Ted Ginn jr during this thread, which seems more like parody than prognostication.

I also understand that, WHEN (not if) Ginn fails to live up to anything more than a decent #2 WR, those who are pumping him up now (paging Mr Rice and Mr Smith) will fall back to the "he didn't have the QB support" position. Likewise, WHEN (not if) Brady Quinn gets his shot as a starter and succeeds, those who put him down now will simply point to his O-line and WRs and say "hell, any QB could be good there."

Bottom line is that nothing will be proven on either player today, so in the immortal words of Dr. Seuss... "We shall see, we shall see."

[simeon]

so in the immortal words of Dr. Seuss... "We shall see, we shall see."

That is awesome, quoting Dr.Seuss for a football post.

[Dphins4me]

You're right...I could be off. So could you. Thus is the glory and agony of prognostication, and the folly of believing that anyone can accurately predict the future every time.

Please tell me what could I be wrong about?    I never predicted Ginn to be any special or not special as others have.  I promise I was not wrong about what the NFL thought of Quinn & where he was drafted & that drafting a player no one that counts deemed worthy of a top 20 slot at No. 9 would have been 100% ignorant.

That said, you've casually thrown Steve Smith and Jerry Rice in the same conversation as Ted Ginn jr during this thread, which seems more like parody than prognostication.

Big X.   I never brought Rice into since he is not a similar type Wr. 

Why do you think Ginn cannot be a No. 1?  I figured his size.  Was I correct?

I also understand that, WHEN (not if) Ginn fails to live up to anything more than a decent #2 WR, those who are pumping him up now (paging Mr Rice and Mr Smith) will fall back to the "he didn't have the QB support" position. Likewise, WHEN (not if) Brady Quinn gets his shot as a starter and succeeds, those who put him down now will simply point to his O-line and WRs and say "hell, any QB could be good there."

Who is pumping him up?  If you think I am, then you had better re-read what I have posted.  No where did I say Ginn will be a great player.  Try reading compherhension 101 no where did I say anything about Ginn & Rice, other than in reply to Defense5499 comment about Rice.  He actually brought Rice into.

   My post have nothing to do with how those players will end up.  This is about where they entered the NFL & what teams thought of their ability.  We know teams did not view Quinn highly enough to draft him in the top 20.  That is a fact, you cannot argue that.  Does not mean he will not succeed.  Just that teams did not feel his talent warranted a higher pick.

We also have reports that another team viewed Ginn as a top ten pick.  Not seen one where teams said Quinn went lower than he should, but that is not to say I've read everything on the net either.

Bottom line is that nothing will be proven on either player today, so in the immortal words of Dr. Seuss... "We shall see, we shall see."

  Yeap, then why make ignorant prediction on players?  If you are wrong will show up & start a thread on how wrong you were?  Highly, highly doubtful

I think making prediction on player is basically silly.

[Dphins4me]

That is awesome, quoting Dr.Seuss for a football post.

It does go with making predictions on the careers of rookies.

[Sunstroke]

Big X.   I never brought Rice into since he is not a similar type Wr. 

My bad...that was 5499 that intro'ed Rice. You just brought Smith into the conversation.

[Dphins4me]

My bad...that was 5499 that intro'ed Rice. You just brought Smith into the conversation.

  I brought up Smith simply because he is a small Wr that produced at a high level as a No. 1 & a No. 1 does not have to be 6'3.

For clarification.  In no way am I suggesting Ginn will be like Smith.  Just that being smaller will not hinder him in being a No. 1 Wr.  Hines Ward is another smaller Wr that carries the No. 1 spot with success.

[bsfins]

I don't see it as his size,but Steve Smith is a jukey little shit,in the way Wes welker is,Ginn (IMO) is more of a Willie Gault,Rocket Ismail type of great speed in a straight line...Doesn't have that wiggle,elusivness of a Steve Smith....