Question for Catholics

[MaineDolFan]

Adam - why do you have to take that tone so brightly when someone doesn't agree with your faith?

You = faithful.

Dave = atheist.

This girl - being freed from the bonds of having to attend church and grow up under the Catholic eye, in the atheist view point, is a winning situation for the girl.

Why is it okay for you to saying something like "God is THAT merciful" - which goes along with YOUR faith but Dave can't express his?  It's basically the SAME comment.  You can...he can't?

Sorry bub, but if anyone is being a "dick" in this situation it's not Dave.

[SCFinfan]

^^

C'mon now. Where do you draw the line between dickish thing to say and statement of faith? Is it really an "atheistic statement of faith" (as if that weren't a contradiction in terms) to say "not pregnant + going to church = winner?" Really? Is that not just merely a crass, disgusting comment in the face of the fact that twin preborn children are now dead, a family is torn up, and a man is going to jail?

Do you honestly expect me to bite my tongue at everything someone says in here? This thread already contained on insult towards people of faith who take seriously the fact that pre-born children have the right to life. What were we called? Oh, yes, that's right... religious fanatics. Is that a statement of faith which I should just respect, Maine? I doubt you would let similar statements pass on subjects you care deeply about.

The fact is that there is a complete difference between me making a theological statement, and Dave's crass expression, which not only showed a thorough misreading of the subject, but also a disregard for the forces at work here.

[bsfins]

Oh geez,can't we have a conversation anymore?

My mom was thrown out of the Catholic church,for getting remarried,better to live in sin....Thrown out by none other than Bernard Law himself,after he stood up for my Mom in court against my Dad....(after they were both brought up on polygamy charges...)

Catholicism = Guilt,Guilt,Guilt!

Which reminds me, I need to to get a burger and eat it in front of my Mom just to hear her shrill in the horror.....

[Guru-In-Vegas]

/highjack

I gotta say I agree with SC. 

I mean for the sake of discussion, fine, there is always room for disagreement.  There are ways to going about it though that don't make you come across as a douche-cock.  I first came on this board and had the video game forum mentality where it was all out war.  LoL...let's just say it didn't make me many friends here.

/end highjack

I grew up in a harcore catholic family.  Around age 19 or 20 I began questioning God and remember feeling scared something bad was going to happen to me.  I don't dare tell my family I'm not a catholic anymore.  I'm sure being excommunicated has that big of an impact. 

I agree with Lil B, catholicism does= guilt, guilt, guilt.

[Phishfan]

Seriously, anyone who thinks a 9 year old girl should have carried twins that resulted from incestuous rape to full term just has a screw loose. I don't care what your religious affiliation is, common sense should tell you to find a new way to worship if that is the general thinking of any church. Not only does she have to deal with this betrayal of her trust, you expect her to have carried the consequences around fro nine months to relive it every day?

[stinkfish]

What about Catholicism makes some feel guilty?

[Buddhagirl]

Seriously, anyone who thinks a 9 year old girl should have carried twins that resulted from incestuous rape to full term just has a screw loose. I don't care what your religious affiliation is, common sense should tell you to find a new way to worship if that is the general thinking of any church. Not only does she have to deal with this betrayal of her trust, you expect her to have carried the consequences around fro nine months to relive it every day?

There was also some discussion as to rather her 9 year old body could even carry the twins. Seriously. Think about how tiny a 9 year old girl is.

[Gabriel]

Seriously, anyone who thinks a 9 year old girl should have carried twins that resulted from incestuous rape to full term just has a screw loose. I don't care what your religious affiliation is, common sense should tell you to find a new way to worship if that is the general thinking of any church. Not only does she have to deal with this betrayal of her trust, you expect her to have carried the consequences around fro nine months to relive it every day?

No one thinks she's culpable. She's 9.

So let's assume she's 18 instead of 9. Then what? In terms of a hierarchy of sin, murder is definitely worse than rape (possibly close, but murder wins). The Catholic church teaches that abortion for any reason, under any circumstances is murder. This isn't complicated and no one should be surprised that the Church is sanctioning the adults involved in this mess. You might disagree with the Church's teaching, but so what? You don't have to believe it.

There are plenty of non-religious folks that think abortion is wrong. I'll concede the view is most popular amongst those who believe in a god, but religion doesn't have a monopoly on that opinion.

[YoFuggedaboutit]

^^

C'mon now. Where do you draw the line between dickish thing to say and statement of faith? Is it really an "atheistic statement of faith" (as if that weren't a contradiction in terms) to say "not pregnant + going to church = winner?" Really? Is that not just merely a crass, disgusting comment in the face of the fact that twin preborn children are now dead, a family is torn up, and a man is going to jail?

Do you honestly expect me to bite my tongue at everything someone says in here? This thread already contained on insult towards people of faith who take seriously the fact that pre-born children have the right to life. What were we called? Oh, yes, that's right... religious fanatics. Is that a statement of faith which I should just respect, Maine? I doubt you would let similar statements pass on subjects you care deeply about.

The fact is that there is a complete difference between me making a theological statement, and Dave's crass expression, which not only showed a thorough misreading of the subject, but also a disregard for the forces at work here.

Sorry SC.  I have to agree with Maine here.  Dave was just saying what HE thought about the girl having an abortion and not having to go to church anymore.  Because God created us with the free will to choose, he is entitled to choose whether or not to believe in God.  As a Christian, while I don't agree with what he said, I didn't find it offensive either.  And you calling him a "smartass dick" was definitely NOT a Christian way of handling it. 

[StL FinFan]

What about Catholicism makes some feel guilty?

Everything.  Everything you do and say and think that is not in line with what the church says makes you a bad person.

I have faith in God, but not so much in the church.

[Gabriel]

Everything.  Everything you do and say and think that is not in line with what the church says makes you a bad person.

I have faith in God, but not so much in the church.

I attended a Catholic church regularly for the first 18 years of my life and I attended Catholic schools from kindergarten through twelfth grade. Not once do I remember feeling guilty, probably because I never really believed any of it. If you feel guilty, then you must believe. If you believe, then why bad mouth the Church?

[YoFuggedaboutit]

I attended a Catholic church regularly for the first 18 years of my life and I attended Catholic schools from kindergarten through twelfth grade. Not once do I remember feeling guilty, probably because I never really believed any of it. If you feel guilty, then you must believe. If you believe, then why bad mouth the Church?

Maybe because she had a bad experience at a certain church.  I know plenty of Christians that don't go to church because they've been "wounded" by the church. 

[StL FinFan]

I attended a Catholic church regularly for the first 18 years of my life and I attended Catholic schools from kindergarten through twelfth grade. Not once do I remember feeling guilty, probably because I never really believed any of it. If you feel guilty, then you must believe. If you believe, then why bad mouth the Church?

I don't feel guilty.  I have my own personal set of beliefs.  I take birth control, I think abortion should be a choice, I eat whatever I want during Lent, I don't attend church regularly, I don't think there is anything wrong with being gay, and I try to be a decent human being all the time.

And no, Tommy, I have not had a bad experience with a church.  I just came to the point where I did not feel the need to be active in a church to follow God, if that makes sense.

Modified to add: Let's just say I cut out the middle man.

[Gabriel]

I don't feel guilty.  I have my own personal set of beliefs.  I take birth control, I think abortion should be a choice, I eat whatever I want during Lent, I don't attend church regularly and I try to be a decent human being all the time.

And no, Tommy, I have not had a bad experience with a church.  I just came to the point where I did not feel the need to be active in a church to follow God, if that makes sense.

That's cool. I thought you were feeling guilty since you described the church as guilt inducing. No worries.

Maybe because she had a bad experience at a certain church.  I know plenty of Christians that don't go to church because they've been "wounded" by the church. 

I'm not sure about all of the denominations, but the Catholic church is pretty clear about the requirement for attending mass and receiving the sacraments. If a person actually believes and still doesn't participate, then that person is an idiot. Now if you don't believe, that's a completely different story.

[Phishfan]

The Catholic Church isn't the only one causing guilt. You should see some of the fire & brimstone churches from my neck of the woods.