Trayvon Martin case

[Sunstroke]

If Martin was still under the effects of marijuana, he would have been far more likely to either laugh at Zimmerman or join him for brunch at Denny's than get violent with him.

Take it from someone who has smoked the stuff for 37 years...pot does NOT make you violent or aggressive.

[Spider-Dan]

Martin was drug-tested in the autopsy, Zimmerman was not tested at all.

The THC talk is just throwing stuff at the wall to see what sticks.

[bsmooth]

He's probably going to get not guilty.  There's too much shit about this case that doesn't make any sense which is why I've stayed away from commenting about it until now.

1.  You don't just shoot somebody and the cops pick you up for it, and you walk out a couple hours later and go home.  Even in a self-defense state like FL.  Regardless of who you shot, in front of that many people, the cops are gonna want to talk to you about it and you're gonna spend a couple nights in jail until your story checks out.  Something obvious has to be screaming self defense or they would have locked him up.

2.  Eyewitnesses keep changing their story.  One says one was on top then switches, then somebody says the other one was on top and then switches. 

3.  Now we find out Martin had drugs in his system.  And the only reason I bring it up is that this kid may have gone off on a guy because he was high and paranoid, when he otherwise would have walked away.

4.  If it's a true murder case or even reasonably looks like one, they wouldn't have had to skip the grand jury.  The fact that the prosecutor said I can't come up with enough shit to even bring a shooting in front of at least 4 people before a grand jury should have screamed that something was off here.

1. The DA came down personally to get him released. This is the type of thing that happens when your daddy is a judge.
2. This is a common occurrence. Besides the witnesses did not see who or what started the actual fight. Not a huge issue.
3. Zimmerman was on two mood enhancing drugs, prescribed from a psychologist at the time of the shooting.
4. Wrong. A grand jury is only needed in Florida if you are pursuing a 1st degree murder charge. Many prosecutors will go to the grand jury to get an indictment if their case is a little weak and they need more time to investigate. The threshold for evidence is lower in a grand jury. The fact this prosecutor indicted without a grand jury makes one believe they think they have a strong enough case to justify 2nd degree murder.

[Phishfan]

While it is a technicality, Zimmerman's father no longer works in the court system so it should say was, not is. Also he was a magistrate and not a judge. Both positions are officers of the court but they are different. Also he served in that role in Virginia. I'm not sure how aware the Sanford PD would have been of that at the time of release even. How much pull does a retired VA magistrate have on a police force from a different state? The answer probably lies somewhere between zero to a lot.

[Spider-Dan]

The fact remains that the state attorney's office immediately (and personally) got involved, well before this blew up in the media.  Whether it was because of his father or not, someone in the power structure had eyes focused very intently on this case from the start.

[el diablo]

The fact remains that the state attorney's office immediately (and personally) got involved, well before this blew up in the media.  Whether it was because of his father or not, someone in the power structure had eyes focused very intently on this case from the start.

Exactly. That right there, without a FULL investigation is what sets Zimmerman on the possible path to an acquittal. Should this even go to trial.

[BigDaddyFin]

1. The DA came down personally to get him released. This is the type of thing that happens when your daddy is a judge.
2. This is a common occurrence. Besides the witnesses did not see who or what started the actual fight. Not a huge issue.
3. Zimmerman was on two mood enhancing drugs, prescribed from a psychologist at the time of the shooting.
4. Wrong. A grand jury is only needed in Florida if you are pursuing a 1st degree murder charge. Many prosecutors will go to the grand jury to get an indictment if their case is a little weak and they need more time to investigate. The threshold for evidence is lower in a grand jury. The fact this prosecutor indicted without a grand jury makes one believe they think they have a strong enough case to justify 2nd degree murder.

1.  What DA where?  Because I haven't heard anything about this.  What does any of this have to do with Zimmerman's father?
2.  Agreed.  But the fact that they keep changing their stories adds to reasonable doubt.
3.  So what?  Everybody's on those now evidently.  That makes another case for temporary insanity pending an appeal, correct?
4.  My point was that they didn't even TRY. 

If Martin was still under the effects of marijuana, he would have been far more likely to either laugh at Zimmerman or join him for brunch at Denny's than get violent with him.

Take it from someone who has smoked the stuff for 37 years...pot does NOT make you violent or aggressive.

My point was it may have affected his judgement.  Not that it would have inherently made him violent.  He could have been high and paranoid enough to fear arrest or stoned out of his mind and not known what country he was in, even though there may not have been anything to fear. 

Don't get me wrong this is a tragedy that ended in the shooting of a kid and it wasn't necessary, but it's up to a jury.  To me there's so much reasonable doubt you can't convict somebody based on it.

[bsmooth]

1.  What DA where?  Because I haven't heard anything about this.  What does any of this have to do with Zimmerman's father?
2.  Agreed.  But the fact that they keep changing their stories adds to reasonable doubt.
3.  So what?  Everybody's on those now evidently.  That makes another case for temporary insanity pending an appeal, correct?
4.  My point was that they didn't even TRY. 

1. The DA came down the night Zimmerman was arrested to have the police release him and say it was justified before the investigation was really even going. There is legitimate speculation that because Zimmerman's father is a judge the DA came down, at night, to do this. The average person would have been arrested and had to post bail.
2. Not really because no witness actually saw the fight start, which is the crux of this case.
3. No he would have to raise that defense at trial, not on appeal. But the point is that the cops tested Martin, but not Zimmerman. More important than that was his refusal to get medical attention and instead telling the police he needed to see his psychologist right away.
4. Irrelevant. Not all criminal indictments come from the grand jury, and this does not mean the case was too weak to present to the grand jury..

[Landshark]

1. The DA came down the night Zimmerman was arrested to have the police release him and say it was justified before the investigation was really even going. There is legitimate speculation that because Zimmerman's father is a judge the DA came down, at night, to do this. The average person would have been arrested and had to post bail.
2. Not really because no witness actually saw the fight start, which is the crux of this case.
3. No he would have to raise that defense at trial, not on appeal. But the point is that the cops tested Martin, but not Zimmerman. More important than that was his refusal to get medical attention and instead telling the police he needed to see his psychologist right away.
4. Irrelevant. Not all criminal indictments come from the grand jury, and this does not mean the case was too weak to present to the grand jury..

It definitely helps to have a relative in the justice system.

[Landshark]

Turns out Zimmerman is back in jail now.  Had his bail revoked because he lied on his financial afadavit in order to get a lower bail. 

[bsmooth]

Turns out Zimmerman is back in jail now.  Had his bail revoked because he lied on his financial afadavit in order to get a lower bail. 

More damage to his credibility.

[Phishfan]

I'm curious how this issue just arose. We all knew about the website and money that was being raised while Zimmerman was in the jail. How was he even able to make a misleading statement about it? We all knew it was there.

[bsmooth]

I'm curious how this issue just arose. We all knew about the website and money that was being raised while Zimmerman was in the jail. How was he even able to make a misleading statement about it? We all knew it was there.

He had to testify as to his finances in court. So he lied to the judge. Even his attorney admits that this really hurts his credibility. The court is supposed to go by what the defendant states in court and not what the papers reports.

[Phishfan]

I realize that, but it was common knowledge when he gave his statement that the money raising website existed. I guess they had to have some time to investigate the money in the account and couldn't dispute it much at the time. This raises the question of are they able to determine when each donation was made.

[Dave Gray]

Nobody had any idea how much had been raised by the website, no?  It was just knowledge that (several) websites existed and that Zimmerman was responsible for one of them.