Boldin to the 49ers

[Spider-Dan]

Show me one report...even a rumor, where Baltimore turned down a better deal than a 6th rounder in order to deal him to SF, and I'll buy it. If not, I'm not... The best offer they got, for a player they were going to release, was the 6th rounder offered by the Niners.

I rejected this logic when used to defend the Marshall trade, and I reject it again now.  "Don't complain about this seemingly dumb move, because we were actually preparing to make an even dumber move in its place!" is not a defense.

If the best offer you received for your best receiver last year (who is still under contract at a reasonable market value) is a 6th round pick, here's another option: let that receiver play out his contract.  They had no problem letting Flacco play out his contract, did they?

[Sunstroke]

If the best offer you received for your best receiver last year (who is still under contract at a reasonable market value) is a 6th round pick, here's another option: let that receiver play out his contract. 

Your definition of "reasonable market value" and the Ravens' version are obviously not the same thing. Thankfully, the Ravens' version is relevant, while yours is just typical Spidey argument-fodder.  I know you feel that your infallible logic would allow you to make better personnel decisions than Ozzie Newsome...I just wish you'd go out and get the gig before asking me to believe it too.

[Spider-Dan]

Again, it's kind of hard to believe your claims about how bad Boldin's contract is when your team happily gave up a draft pick for the privilege of taking on said contract.

I've already asked you to cite another example of a contending team dumping their top receiver for peanuts (particularly when he had a contract in line with those currently being dished out to #2s).  I'm still waiting.

[Sunstroke]

I asked for concrete details (proof of a better offer to support your insinuation of collusion), and you're asking me for a precedent based on your belief that Boldin was their best WR last year (which isn't even relevant to his value "this year."). One of us (me) is waiting for facts, and one of us (you) is waiting for the other to dig up some information so you can continue arguing in circles.

Enjoy the wait...

[Spider-Dan]

Why are you waiting for proof of a better offer?  If MIA offers ARI a 4th-rounder for Fitz, are they somehow required to say, "Oh well, we don't have any better offers on the table, guess we have to take that one!"?

I already said that if your best offer for your current (not future, current) leading receiver is a 6th round pick, you pass on that offer.

Unless it's from your baby brother.  Then maybe you take it.

[Sunstroke]

Why are you waiting for proof of a better offer?  If MIA offers ARI a 4th-rounder for Fitz, are they somehow required to say, "Oh well, we don't have any better offers on the table, guess we have to take that one!"?

Yes, I was waiting for proof of a better offer. Thanks for making me repeat what was a very clear question. Your entire argument is based on some twilight-zonish assumption that Baltimore was willing to pay Anquan the salary he was asking for, should they not receive a trade offer that matches up with some random value point that you believe the Ravens' front office should have.

Try wrapping your head around this... Baltimore is going to release a WR who they considered too expensive and who wasn't willing to consider a pay cut. They ask around..."Hey, league, will anyone offer us some tasty draft picks for a WR who is still playing very well?"  Alas, despite Boldin's recent playoff performance and an eloquent letter of recommendation by some dude on a Dolphins chat board, the personnel guys for the other 31 teams think "Hmmm, he's 32 years old, he'll cost 6 million, he's openly contemplated retirement in the past few weeks...and, oh yeah, his club is rumored to be considering releasing him anyway!"

Baltimore loads up the call center in anticipation of the avalanche of offers they're certain are forthcoming. Unfortunately, the phone rings only twice. The first offer comes from the Vikings, a team that is in the process of trading away their best WR and have virtually nothing in the WR cupboard once he's gone. What do you mean they won't budge off their "nothing more than a 7th round pick" offer? Don't they know that he's ten times better than any WR they have on their roster? Don't they realize what he's worth...to Spider-Dan?  After getting zero interest from the rest of the league, they finally get a second nibble on the hook. The 49ers are willing to offer a 6th round pick.

That night, Ozzie contemplates his three options.  Release Boldin outright due to financial considerations... Trade him to Minnesota for a 7th round pick... Trade him to San Francisco for a 6th round pick...  The math seems simple to him, but Ozzie tosses and turns all night, with cold sweats when considering the possible Harbaugh "conspiracy theories" that might pop up on random small football chat boards.  In the end, he goes by the numbers and deals him for the best offer he received...a 6th rounder from the 49ers.

I already said that if your best offer for your current (not future, current) leading receiver is a 6th round pick, you pass on that offer.

I know you did...take it up with Ozzie. I'm sure if you argue with him about it with the tenacity that you argue with on this board, he'll eventually break down and offer you his job.

Unless it's from your baby brother.  Then maybe you take it.

The offer was from the 49ers GM, Trent Baalke, to the Ravens GM, Ozzie Newsome. Unless you're ready to present evidence gleaned from ancestry.com or some other genealogical research, I'm fairly certain that Trent and Ozzie aren't brothers.

[Spider-Dan]

Try wrapping your head around this... Baltimore is going to release a WR who they considered too expensive and who wasn't willing to consider a pay cut. They ask around..."Hey, league, will anyone offer us some tasty draft picks for a WR who is still playing very well?"  Alas, despite Boldin's recent playoff performance and an eloquent letter of recommendation by some dude on a Dolphins chat board, the personnel guys for the other 31 teams think "Hmmm, he's 32 years old, he'll cost 6 million, he's openly contemplated retirement in the past few weeks...and, oh yeah, his club is rumored to be considering releasing him anyway!"

I think you mean 29 teams, since there's at least two teams that said, "Anquan Boldin at $6M for one year?  Hell yes!  We'll even give you a draft pick for him!"

And, strangely enough, I don't see anyone, anywhere, saying, "49ers gave up a 6th to pay Boldin $6M for a year... what a horrible move on their part."  Weird how everyone seems to be praising the 49ers for picking up the contract of a guy who is supposedly not worth what he's being paid (and giving up a draft pick to do so).  How can you rationalize the Ravens dumping the salary of an "overpaid player" at the same time you are cheering the 49ers for picking up the contract of THAT SAME PLAYER?  One of those two positions has to be wrong.

That night, Ozzie contemplates his three options.  Release Boldin outright due to financial considerations... Trade him to Minnesota for a 7th round pick... Trade him to San Francisco for a 6th round pick...  The math seems simple to him, but Ozzie tosses and turns all night, with cold sweats when considering the possible Harbaugh "conspiracy theories" that might pop up on random small football chat boards.

A nighttime contemplation is a great setting for this story, because when Ozzie woke up, he could have realized, "Gee, maybe I can just decide to keep my team's leading receiver for less than what it would cost me to sign a Brian Hartline-level replacement in free agency!"  You continue to frame this decision as if the Ravens were forced to choose between dumb move (trade Boldin for a 6th) and dumber move (cut him), when that is not the case.

I suppose if the Ravens hadn't received any offers for Boldin, you would be ardently praising BAL's decision to cut him?  I mean, what else could they have done?

[Sunstroke]

Thank you for your opinion...it's been duly noted, reviewed, and filed accordingly.  If you come up with some actual evidence of that Harbaugh brother collusion conspiracy bullshit you were spouting that spawned this conversation, just let me know.

[Spider-Dan]

Perhaps you misunderstand my position.

I said that this was John throwing Jim a bone because the alternative is that Baltimore is freaking stupid to cut their leading WR on account of the $6M he is due next year.  My evidence for the stupidity of such a decision is the universal praise SF has received for bringing on Boldin at that same price tag (and giving up a draft pick to do so).  So maybe you're right: why attribute this trade to collusion when it is sufficiently explained by sheer incompetence?

In any case, I look forward to you maintaining this same standard of evidentiary rigorousness when it comes to defending trades that don't benefit your favorite team in the future.

[Sunstroke]

I almost always understand your position...I just often find it ridiculous.

[Landshark]

I almost always understand your position...I just often find it ridiculous.

I don't think it's ridiculous to think that John might've said something to Jim along the lines of, "Normally I would ask for a fourth rounder for Boldin, but for you my little brother, a sixth rounder." And it was said before the Ravens entertained any other offers.  Granted, there is no evidence of this, so one can only wonder if this happened.  You are right about one thing.  The Niners came out with a smashing deal.

[Sunstroke]

I'm absolutely positive that the Boldin trade was contemplated by John and Jim way back in elementary school.  "Whichever one of us wins the Super Bowl as a head coach first will deal a good player on the cheap to the other, so both of us can have Super Bowl rings."

I don't think it's ridiculous to think that John might've said something to Jim along the lines of, "Normally I would ask for a fourth rounder for Boldin, but for you my little brother, a sixth rounder."

No one else in the entire league would offer more than a 7th rounder... The only 4th rounder is in your mind, Professor Shandlark, not in either of the Harbaugh's

Granted, there is no evidence of this...

Exactly...

[Phishfan]

I'm surprised the GMs even have a job with their respective organizations since the coaches colluded this trade without their consent. 

I do admit, it is the first thing that pops into your head but follwing your first instinct is not always right contrary to the old saying.

[Landshark]

This article makes a big stink on why the Dolphins never went after Boldin, despite him being a local product.  One part that stands out to me is this:

Back when Dave Wannstedt had the final say in 2003, Miami had a shot at Boldin in the second round but took a mediocre linebacker named Eddie Moore who never got up to speed.

Labelling Eddie Moore as mediocre is way too kind.  The guy was garbage.


http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/sports/football/dave-george-too-bad-the-miami-dolphins-never-have-/nWrCG/