Shutdown watch

[Landshark]

Now who's being naive Kay.

That would be you.  There's a clear difference between impeachment and recall

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

That would be you.  There's a clear difference between impeachment and recall

No, that would be you. 

Read the US Constitution.  There is no provision for recall.  Nor provision of your friends proposal, absent an amendment to the Constitution. 

[Landshark]

No, that would be you. 

Read the US Constitution.  There is no provision for recall.  Nor provision of your friends proposal, absent an amendment to the Constitution. 

And who says an ammendment can't take place?

[Fau Teixeira]

That would be you.  There's a clear difference between impeachment and recall

Show me where we have a recall at the federal level.

Show me what what 'high crimes and misdemenors' were committed when articles of impeachment were drawn up against andrew johnson

[Spider-Dan]

And who says an ammendment can't take place?

I think if Congress doesn't pass a budget, they should all be forced to work in their current roles for free for the next 10 years and their families should all lose the right to vote.  That will motivate them to do their job.

Oh, wait, that would be unconstitutional?  Well, we can just change the Constitution, right?

[Fau Teixeira]

why stop there .. lets put the entire congress to death by guillotine at halftime of the superbowl .. we can just pass a constitutional ammendment and it will be constitutional .. hooray !

[Spider-Dan]

So Obama gets to decide which parts of the law he wants to implement in order to fool the American people until after the midterm elections? If you're going to delay the employer mandate, why not the individual mandate also?

Please explain the following:

1) How is delaying the employer mandate but not the individual mandate "fooling the American people until after the midterm election," when individuals can vote in said election and corporations cannot?

2) If the purpose of delaying mandates is to deceive others into believing the law is good, why are the Republicans the ones insisting on delaying the individual mandate?

No, the shutdown has nothing to do with obamacare, the gop, or the continuing resolution.

Ladies and gentlemen, the 2013 Republican Party.

To rational, reasonable Americans, the shutdown has EVERYTHING to do with the continuing resolution.  But conservatives see a functioning government as merely a bargaining chip, just as they do with a functioning world economy.

[Cathal]

why stop there .. lets put the entire congress to death by guillotine at halftime of the superbowl .. we can just pass a constitutional ammendment and it will be constitutional .. hooray !

I'd be for that.

[Spider-Dan]

Democrats seem to be dancing on the fact they can blame Republicans for the shutdown and were doing so weeks ahead of time instead of negotiating with them.

Yes, because it was obvious that the House GOP was intent on using the shutdown as a hostage to gain concessions.

Let me explain the important part in this discussion: both sides agree that the government needs to be funded.  You will find no Republican member of Congress who has stated that we should not be funding the government.  The same goes for the debt ceiling; none of them even believe that the debt limit we already have is enough and we should just make do.  Both sides agree that these things should be passed.

Yet, one faction of one party (the minority party, mind you) believes that these items of action, which both sides agree are critical and necessary, should be used as leverage to extract totally unrelated concessions.  It's as if the Democrats said, "We will agree to raise the debt ceiling, but only if we get increased federal funding for abortions."

I don't think that's a smart move on their part. First off, if Republicans are already being blamed, and they are, they have no incentive to give in to anything until they get what they want. The damage has been done.

I don't think that's how blame works.

If the GOP doesn't back down on their ransom demands and the shutdown continues, they will continue to receive present-tense criticism.
If  they do back down and the shutdown ends, that criticism will end (or switch to past-tense, which is much different than present-tense).

Secondly the longer it goes on the more people are realizing that less government is needed. That fits solely into the Republican ideals.

1995 called.  They have a slightly different take on this subject.

[Fau Teixeira]

I'd be for that.

Are you tommy's friend ?

[dolphins4life]

Is this what the conservatives do when they don't get their way?

I have seen the prices of the premiums and they seem VERY affordable.

[Landshark]

I have seen the prices of the premiums and they seem VERY affordable.

You're right. But the underlying fact is that no one should be forced to buy something they don't want to buy. Especially because the law doesn't apply to Congress

[Spider-Dan]

dolphins4life, the price of the premiums (along with pretty much every other part of Obamacare) is quite literally irrelevant to the discussion, as ridiculous as that seems.

If the GOP had legitimate concerns about specific parts of Obamacare, they would be passing bills to fix those individual parts (which would then result in normal compromise of give up X to get Y).  Instead, they see it as a way to delegitimize and defeat Obama, so their only two acceptable "modifications" are:

1) complete repeal/defunding
2) delay of implementation until #1 can be achieved

[Spider-Dan]

You're right. But the underlying fact is that no one should be forced to buy something they don't want to buy.

Do you mean like when I pay a tax for new schools, even though I don't have kids?  Or when my tax money goes to fund a war I don't agree with?

Especially because the law doesn't apply to Congress

Not only is it a fact that Obamacare DOES apply to Congress, but they get a special, harsher version that the GOP inserted in as an amendment to try to kill it at the last hour.

[Cathal]

Are you tommy's friend ?

Hell no. But it makes sense. If people can't figure something out and actually run a country then elect new people. Having one term limit would also be a step in the right direction.