It's official: Hillary vs. Trump

[DaLittle B]

I'm a white,40 yr old (be 41 in less than 2 weeks),underemployed (somewhat by choice),with no college degree,living in the Midwest. Not exactly great feelings on my future,but I keep thinking Trump's message/things he says should resonant with me some how....   If he's trying to get me into voting for him,the more he talks the more I want to support Hilary. (It doesn't help I'm bombarded by the media of Donald Trump...Local Network T.V. has almost become almost unwatchable. The local Politicians are adding to that problem significantly)

[CF DolFan]

Has she told falsehoods?.....yes. 

At a greater rate than Bill Clinton, George W Bush, George H Bush, Ronald Reagan, Mitt Romney?  No!

This remark is so off base it really discredits anything else you say. You are smarter than that. At least I admit I look past some of Trump's faults. I'm not completely disregarding them. 

Like has been mentioned ... even Obama used to bring up how much Hillary lies. There is so much evidence out there against her there really isn't anything you could say to make her, or yourself, look better by ignoring it.

edited to add CNN is reporting that as of today she is still conmuing to lie.\

"I was pointing out in both of those instances, that Director Comey had said that my answers in my FBI interview were truthful. That really is the bottom line here," she said. "What I told the FBI, which he said was truthful, is consistent with what I have said publicly. I may have short-circuited and for that I will try to clarify."
Clinton went on to repeat that she "never sent or received" classified information on her private email server -- a statement that is inconsistent with Comey's testimony on Capitol Hill.
"And I would go back to where I started, I regret using one account, I have taken responsibility for that," Clinton said.
The email controversy has continued to dog Clinton's presidential campaign, particularly as she suffers from the widespread perception among voters that she isn't honest or trustworthy.

[Spider-Dan]

Yes, during their primary Obama accused Hillary of lying, and Hillary also accused Obama of lying.  That's the point we are making: you are saying that she is significantly more dishonest than previous candidates, and we are saying that any and all of them can be accused of having lied.  Which makes Hillary a pretty standard politician, in comparison to Trump who is an outrageous buffoon.

[CF DolFan]

Yes, during their primary Obama accused Hillary of lying, and Hillary also accused Obama of lying.  That's the point we are making: you are saying that she is significantly more dishonest than previous candidates, and we are saying that any and all of them can be accused of having lied.  Which makes Hillary a pretty standard politician, in comparison to Trump who is an outrageous buffoon.

You guys are in complete denial and yet you want people to take you seriously? Do you even read papers or watch the news?

From Los Angeles Times today

Hillary Clinton says she takes it 'seriously' when polls show her as untrustworthy

Ahead of last week's Democratic National Convention, a CNN/ORC poll found that 68% of respondents said Clinton isn't honest and trustworthy. That was up from 65% earlier in July and 59% in May.

http://www.latimes.com/nation/politics/trailguide/la-na-trailguide-updates-hillary-clinton-says-she-takes-it-1470421885-htmlstory.html

Rasmussen
Wednesday, June 01, 2016

Republicans have a lot more confidence in Donald Trump’s honesty than Democrats do in the honesty of Hillary Clinton.

A new Rasmussen Reports national telephone and online survey finds that 30% of all Likely U.S. Voters think Trump is more honest than most other politicians. Just half as many (15%) think Clinton is more honest than most of her peers.

In both cases, however, a plurality thinks Trump (45%) and Clinton (46%) are less honest than most other politicians.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/elections/election_2016/how_do_voters_weigh_clinton_s_honesty_vs_trump_s

and plenty more just by using Google. You should try it

[Spider-Dan]

I don't dispute that people think Hillary is less honest.  There is plenty of evidence of that in this thread.

I am saying that perception is inaccurate, and that Hillary is no less honest than her husband or any number of other previous Presidential candidates.  And whenever I ask why people think Hillary is less honest than her husband, I receive vague answers that don't address the many, many lies Bill Clinton was also accused of.

The fact that we are sitting here while conservatives try to pretend that Bill Clinton - the man they attacked endlessly while in office - is now somehow magically quite honest in their eyes is a pretty clear example of how ridiculous this is.  And when I ask if Hillary is more honest than our current tyrannical dictator-in-chief who is hellbent on destroying this country, all I get is crickets.

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

edited to add CNN is reporting that as of today she is still conmuing to lie.\

Congratulations you found an example where she lied.  Want more go here...
http://www.politifact.com/personalities/

They have rated 27% of the statements of her's that they analyzed as either mostly false, false or pants on fire.  And 50%as True or mostly true.  

However with Trump only 15% where true or mostly true; and 70% mostly false, false or pants on fire.  

That makes her considerably more honest than Trump.

She is about even with Obama 48% True or mostly true and 26% in the false categories.  

Close to Sanders 52% positive and 28% negative  

Her Husband has scores of 48% positive and 23% negative.  

[Spider-Dan]

Want more?

[Fau Teixeira]

No one wants your stinking communist pinko facts round these parts. We don't hold much for facts here.

[pondwater]

Want more?

Politifact? Haha, yeah sure.
http://www.usnews.com/opinion/blogs/peter-roff/2013/05/28/study-finds-fact-checkers-biased-against-republicans

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

Politifact? Haha, yeah sure.
http://www.usnews.com/opinion/blogs/peter-roff/2013/05/28/study-finds-fact-checkers-biased-against-republicans

In other news, the former political director of a Republican PAC determines that the reason why an independent non-partisan journalism watch group reports Republicans lie more is not because they lie more but because the independent source is bias. 

Wait that is was the news.  Trump and Gingrinch lie more often than Clinton or Obama but lets blame the press for pointing that out.     

[Fau Teixeira]

Truthiness

[pondwater]

In other news, the former political director of a Republican PAC determines that the reason why an independent non-partisan journalism watch group reports Republicans lie more is not because they lie more but because the independent source is bias. 

Wait that is was the news.  Trump and Gingrinch lie more often than Clinton or Obama but lets blame the press for pointing that out.     

Truthiness

I guess Snopes isn't biased either, haha. Spin it any way you want, that's your job as a liberal. Only to spin and deflect.

Leave it to TDMMC for the best fictional entertainment in politics on the interwebz. And the admin wonders why these forums need a shot in the arm, lmfao!

[Spider-Dan]

Everyone is aware that facts have a well-known liberal bias.  Just like science!

So it looks like it can be summed up as: Hillary is dishonest because she lies, and her statements are lies because we say they are.

[Spider-Dan]

I'd also like to point out that even if one believed that the PolitiFact chart had things exactly backwards, Hillary would still be in the same ballpark as the current President and the primary candidate this cycle that got the highest marks for honesty (Sanders).

Given that my point was only that Hillary is a standard politician (and not that she is more honest than most, which is what that chart shows), you have to do some major jumping through hoops to somehow arrive at the conclusion that Hillary is exceptionally dishonest.  Let me guess: PolitiFact is only skewing the results for Hillary, but not Obama?

Two of the top five "least dishonest" candidates are Republicans and the right is still complaining about bias.  Sad!

[mecadonzilla]

I think the problem is when you get your news from AM radio, Fox News, and sites like The Blaze, pretty much anything will seem decidedly liberal.  Anything short of state controlled Iranian daily news is to the left of the spectrum for these folks.  The echo chamber is too strong.  The idea of a liberal media is as completely laughable as gay conversion therapy. 

I also find it interesting that the modern Republican party has aligned itself so totally with fundamental Christianity, that the two are nearly indistinguishable from one another in ideology. It's as if a definite, strong monotheistic POV has completely integrated itself into the political/religious culture of a group of certain people who want to run things their way.  Or you know, a theocracy...which is totally okay from their POV as long as they're the ones in charge of which religion gets to control things, as their religion is the only right one anyway.