Do you ever give to panhandlers?

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

Republicans want to limit food stamps and spend more to train.

Wrong.  Well at least on the last half, republicans are the ones who always want cut training, rehab, financial aid for students, etc. in favor for tax breaks for the mega wealthy.

[Dave Gray]

I don't mind giving to the needy.  I just want it done through the appropriate channels and not encourage begging on the side of the road.

I fully support a government safety net, though.

[Spider-Dan]

There is a middle ground between "I want to give homeless people money to buy drugs with" and "I think the only safety net should be a free pair of bootstraps to pull yourself up by."

I am not in favor of giving homeless people money, because I believe there is a large contingent of the serial homeless who have substance abuse or mental health problems.  But I'm strongly in favor of government programs like food stamps and unemployment benefits (two things Republicans love to cut), and while I think it's a bad idea to give money directly to the homeless, I think it's a great idea to give money to homeless shelters.

[CF DolFan]

I wonder how much of these entitlements people would want for society if Republicans and Libertarians weren't paying for them.  Somehow I think they wouldn't want to give so freely. It's easy to want others to foot the bill.

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

That is total bullshit right there.  Liberals/democrats pay taxes too. 

Almost everything Warren Buffet advocates would raise his own tax burden. 

And it really isn't about higher or lower taxes, it is about where we are going to spend the money, build more prisons or spend more on rehab?

Build a wall that won't do squat to stop illegal immigration or provide hungry school children with lunch?

Spend more on vocational education so that people can get jobs or spend more on cops when people resort to crime?

[Spider-Dan]

I wonder how much of these entitlements people would want for society if Republicans and Libertarians weren't paying for them.  Somehow I think they wouldn't want to give so freely. It's easy to want others to foot the bill.

I'd say you have it exactly backwards.


Notice how most of the red (taker) states are also red (Republican) states.

It has been established for quite a while that, as seen above, red states set their tax rates too low to actually support the services their residents demand, then sidle over to the federal trough and suck on the teat of the blue states that pay more in federal taxes than they receive in services.

So the real question is: what kind of appetite would Republicans and Libertarians have for tax cuts if the left wasn't subsidizing their lifestyles with federal spending?

[Fau Teixeira]

Utah fixed their homeless problem by building apartments for everyone that was homeless, problem solved.

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

Spider counters bullshit with actual facts, snap.

[CF DolFan]

Spider counters bullshit with actual facts, snap.

First off whatever BS site this came from it isn't legit. California has been almost bankrupt so many times I can't count. To pretend they don't get the lion's share is crazy. It's not only old info its bad or photo shopped.

[Sunstroke]

^^^ Ah yes, the "Fake News" defense...where have I seen that used before?

Oh yeah, pretty much every GOP member in the country since Trump took hijacked the office. If you don't agree with it, it just ain't real!

[Phishfan]

We are talking two different things if you want to discuss the state's own surplus or minus (going bankrupt) and their federal tax surplus or minus. As a matter of fact, not receiving the federal funds would assist in creating a state's bankruptcy rather than the other way around.

I agree what Spider supplied has some age, so here is a 2017 article that still states California pays more in federal money than they get back.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/08/us/california-today-federal-taxes.html?_r=0

[Spider-Dan]

First off whatever BS site this came from it isn't legit.

The Economist is not exactly a fly-by-night lefty rag.  It has been publishing since 1843.

California has been almost bankrupt so many times I can't count. To pretend they don't get the lion's share is crazy. It's not only old info its bad or photo shopped.

I notice that you did not even attempt to provide any evidence in rebuttal.  Instead, you simply declared "fake news!" and called it a day.

Your point about "nearly bankrupt" does not help your argument.  As Phishfan mentioned, the fact that blue states are likely to spend their own tax revenue on services for their residents - as opposed to the red state strategy of primarily relying on leeched federal funds - makes it rather obvious that they would be more likely to have budget problems.  It's a lot easier to avoid state budget problems when you rely on the feds to pay for all the services in your state!

To tie this back into the original topic, your accusation is not unlike pointing out that a homeless, unemployed person has "less debt" than an employed person with a student loan, mortgage, and car payment.  You don't have to worry about bankruptcy or foreclosure when you don't have anything!

[Spider-Dan]

Just as a short exercise in basic logic, CF, tell me which part of the following you disagree with:

1) Blue states generally have higher minimum wages than red states
2) Blue states generally have higher per capita income than red states
3) Higher income means you generally pay more in federal taxes
4) Lower income means you generally qualify for more federal assistance benefits (especially among those making minimum wage)

I don't understand why you would think my original statement is controversial.  It is the expected result of liberal vs. conservative policy.

[CF DolFan]

I notice that you did not even attempt to provide any evidence in rebuttal.  Instead, you simply declared "fake news!" and called it a day.

Honestly ... I don't have time these days. I pop in for a few minutes here and there but there is no way I can keep up with you guys so most times I don't even try.

[Fau Teixeira]

Honestly ... I don't have time these days. I pop in for a few minutes here and there but there is no way I can keep up with you guys so most times I don't even try.

That's exactly how i feel, I read through these exchanges and i just don't have time sometimes to write something out