Shame of the Game - Patriots

[Dave Gray]

It's more of your delusional hatred of the Patriots.

The Patriots actually got most calls to go AGAINST them, during the Brady years.

Crazy talk.

When you're good, calls break your way, because refs give you the benefit of the doubt.  The Pats were the beneficiaries of bogus calls on the regular.  I expect it, but to say the opposite just isn't true.

[dolphins4life]

Crazy talk.

When you're good, calls break your way, because refs give you the benefit of the doubt.  The Pats were the beneficiaries of bogus calls on the regular.  I expect it, but to say the opposite just isn't true.

Not for the Patriots.

[dolphins4life]

In 2005 in the AFC divisional playoffs against Denver, the refs set up a Denver Broncos touchdown with a HORRIBLE pass interference call on Asante Samuel.  Then, in the third quarter, they set up another Broncos touchdown by incorrectly ruling that Champ Bailey had fumbled the ball out of bounds at the one yard line, rather than through the end zone.

In the 2006 AFC championship game, the refs stopped the Patriots from putting the game away in the second quarter by calling a bad pass interference penalty against Troy Brown, which negated what would have been a first down inside the Colts 20, with the Patriots already winning 21-3.  Then in the second half, they called a phantom PI call on Ellis Hobbs to give the Colts another touchdown. Then, in the fourth quarter, they didn't call a blatant pass interference against the Colts in the end zone.

In the 2007 Super Bowl, the refs missed blatant holding on the Giants on Tyree's famous helmet catch.

In the 2015 AFC title game, they didn't call blatant pass interference on Gronkowski in the end zone.

In 2017 Super Bowl, they didn't call blatant illegal contact on the Eagles on the last play of the game.

In 2019, the refs blew two calls against the Chiefs (the quick whistle on the fumble and wrongly ruling that Harry did not score) which may have cost NE that game and a first round bye.

To say the refs haven't hurt the Patriots greatly over the years is not true.  

Edit:  And some of the calls people do cite are misleading.  For example, in the 2017 AFC title game against the Jaguars, that PI against Bouye was the correct call.  And that quick whistle only occurred after the refs missed a blatant pass interference against the Jaguars.  And on the roughing the passer call against the Chiefs, the Chiefs mauled the Patriots receivers all day, and were on the right end of several calls and non-calls.

[Spider-Dan]

dolphins4life, has the NFL admitted that ANY of those plays were blown calls?  Because this (or this, or this) is what happens when there's actually a blown call, as opposed to a call that biased homers (ahem) just disagree with.

[dolphins4life]

dolphins4life, has the NFL admitted that ANY of those plays were blown calls?  Because this (or this, or this) is what happens when there's actually a blown call, as opposed to a call that biased homers (ahem) just disagree with.

In some cases, yes, like the Ellis Hobbs play in the 2006 AFC title game.  However, every call I have cited you can actually see for yourself on video.

The Champ Bailey/Ben Watson play was analyzed scientifically to prove that the ball did indeed pass over the pylon, which should have made it a touchback.

I do not know if the NFL publicly admitted that N'Keal Harry did not step out of bounds against the Chiefs last year.  However, this does not change the fact that he did not.    

Here's the last play of Super Bowl 52

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WeHunswDrGE

If that is not blatant illegal contact. (Shoving a receiver while running his route), I don't know what is.

Also, Spider, it's VERY interesting how you don't apply that same standard to calls that you and the other people on this board THINK have gone against the Patriots.  Many times, when rules are correctly applied that benefit the Patriots, people here think they are bad calls.

Conclusion:  Spider-Dan thinks that all calls made by officials are correct unless the NFL openly admits that they were bad.

I understand that there is room for debate and interpretation on calls, but the examples I've cited are so blatant and so flagrant that there is simply no fathomable way you could watch a video and defend ANY of them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=23oEg5ljBkY  Just as another example.  How is that not the most obvious pass interference you've ever seen?

[Spider-Dan]

In some cases, yes, like the Ellis Hobbs play in the 2006 AFC title game.

Please cite where the NFL issued a statement about this "blown call."  I can find no such admission.

Also, Spider, it's VERY interesting how you don't apply that same standard to calls that you and the other people on this board THINK have gone against the Patriots.

The difference between us is that I understand that I, as a Dolphins fan, have a biased view towards the outcome of a play that involves the Dolphins.  But even from my biased perspective as a fan, I would not claim that the "majority of bad calls go against the Dolphins."

But that's the claim you just made... for the New England Patriots.  Even though that claim is not backed up by any sort of objective analysis (e.g. the NFL admitting they are wrong).  It's basically just you insisting that the refs screwed NE.

So yeah, we can sit here and post videos back and forth of uncalled pass interference and uncalled holding all day long.  (The January 2004 AFC Championship against IND might be a fun place to start.)  This does not rise to the level of "clearly blown calls" acknowledged by the league.

[Tenshot13]

D4L Patriots homer bias confirmed

[Sunstroke]

^^^ Wait...was that ever in doubt?

[dolphins4life]

Spider,

https://www.patriots.com/news/league-official-admits-a-bad-call-was-made-136881

Also, can you confirm your belief that if the league does not say anything about a call, then it was correct?  I notice you did not comment on my examples.  After why would you when you have nothing to rebut.   

Tenshot, providing objective analysis of calls is not homerism.  Homerism is you claiming CORRECT calls are bad calls simply because you dislike the team.

Stroke, your post makes sense because your team benefited from the biggest sham in NFL history.  (The 1994 NFC championship game)

If you want an example of a call for the Patriots that was bad, that I claimed was bad, and that the NFL admitted was bad, I cite the Rams SB with the uncalled PI, which oddly enough, everybody on this board said was good.

[Sunstroke]

Stroke, your post makes sense because your team benefited from the biggest sham in NFL history. 

All my posts make sense, unless I'm intentionally providing nonsense.

You are an out-of-the-closet Patriots fan who thinks the refs are out to get the Dolphins.

Yes, you are...and no, they're not...

[Spider-Dan]

Spider,

https://www.patriots.com/news/league-official-admits-a-bad-call-was-made-136881

In this case you are citing (from an article on Patriots.com, no less) "league official" = "senior editor of Jaguars.com responding to a fan mailbag." Sorry, but that's quite a bit less authoritative than the league office issuing a press release, as in the cases I cited.

If you aren't a delusional Pats homer, you're doing a great job of simulating one.

Also, can you confirm your belief that if the league does not say anything about a call, then it was correct?

Depends.  Can you "confirm your belief" that every uncalled holding is actually a league conspiracy against Bill Belichick's defense?

The fact that you are throwing up videos of Hail Mary passes as "examples" of uncalled pass interference (while bragging that they can't be disputed) shows how far gone you are.  How many calls of pass interference have you seen on a Hail Mary in your lifetime?

[dolphins4life]

In this case you are citing (from an article on Patriots.com, no less) "league official" = "senior editor of Jaguars.com responding to a fan mailbag." Sorry, but that's quite a bit less authoritative than the league office issuing a press release, as in the cases I cited.

If you aren't a delusional Pats homer, you're doing a great job of simulating one.
Depends.  Can you "confirm your belief" that every uncalled holding is actually a league conspiracy against Bill Belichick's defense?

The fact that you are throwing up videos of Hail Mary passes as "examples" of uncalled pass interference (while bragging that they can't be disputed) shows how far gone you are.  How many calls of pass interference have you seen on a Hail Mary in your lifetime?

Maybe this is better?

https://www.footballforum.com/new-england-patriots/23165-nfl-apologizes-hobbs.html.  The league actually sent a letter of apology to Ellis Hobbs.

If you want to watch the play itself, the game is on youtube.  Hobbs never touches Reggie Wayne at all. In order to commit pass interference, you actually have to touch the receiver you are interfering with.  

As for the Eagles play, you are twisting words that I said.  I NEVER said it was PASS INTERFERENCE.  It was ILLEGAL CONTACT.  BIG difference between those two penalties.   Yes, you rarely see DPI called on hail marys, but this is blatantly shoving the receiver to knock him off his route.  If that's legal, why doesn't every team do that on the last play of the game?  It should have given the Patriots one more play from the Eagles 46 yard line.

Don't even know what you meant with uncalled holding being a conspiracy against BBs defense.  

As as for me being a Patriots fan, a fan is somebody who roots for the team to win.  During the Brady years, I never rooted for the Patriots to win unless them winning helped Miami's playoff chances.  I did start out rooting for them early in this year when I thought Miami was not going to be good.  I was hoping that it would help show that Tom Brady is overrated and wins more because of his teammates and opponents, rather than because he plays better, but that theory got shot down  

Analyzing officiating has NOTHING to do with the team I root for.  Is this really so hard to understand?

[dolphins4life]

Spider, I am still confused by your response to my previous question.

If the NFL does not publicly admit that a call was bad, does that mean it was the correct call? 

[dolphins4life]

When the Patriots beat the Falcons in the Super Bowl, I was so depressed that I took $5000 out of my savings account and invested it in the stock market.   

[Spider-Dan]

https://www.footballforum.com/new-england-patriots/23165-nfl-apologizes-hobbs.html.  The league actually sent a letter of apology to Ellis Hobbs.

I wonder... was this unnamed "league official" a stadium usher for the Texans?  Or perhaps a parking attendant in Pittsburgh?  I mean, since the previous standard of "league official" was "Jaguars website guy."

I gave you multiple examples of the league office publicly admitting a bad call, which is not the same thing as a player supposedly receiving a secret letter.

As for the Eagles play, you are twisting words that I said.  I NEVER said it was PASS INTERFERENCE.  It was ILLEGAL CONTACT.  BIG difference between those two penalties.   Yes, you rarely see DPI called on hail marys, but this is blatantly shoving the receiver to knock him off his route.

OK, if you insist: how many times have you seen pass interference ILLEGAL CONTACT called on a Hail Mary in your lifetime?

If the NFL does not publicly admit that a call was bad, does that mean it was the correct call?

What it means is that the official's judgement call is within the range of acceptable interpretations of what happened.  So you or I can disagree with the official, but it's not up to OUR judgement, it's up to HIS. 

As long as the league feels that the official's subjective judgement is reasonable, they will let the call stand without correction.  When they feel that the official's judgement on a call was NOT within reasonable bounds, they issue a public correction, as in the cases I cited earlier.