Super Bowl LV Thoughts

[Spider-Dan]

I'm pretty sure Tom Brady didn't put the clamps on the Greatest Show on Turf.  Nor did he hold the #1 offense in the league to 3 points in the Super Bowl.

You guys are going way over the top with these Belichick hot takes.

[Tenshot13]

I'm pretty sure Tom Brady didn't put the clamps on the Greatest Show on Turf.  Nor did he hold the #1 offense in the league to 3 points in the Super Bowl.

You guys are going way over the top with these Belichick hot takes.

I agree with Spider, take a screenshot.

[dolphins4life]

I'm pretty sure Tom Brady didn't put the clamps on the Greatest Show on Turf.  Nor did he hold the #1 offense in the league to 3 points in the Super Bowl.

You guys are going way over the top with these Belichick hot takes.

Yes he did, Spider.  Didn't you read Maine's posts?  The "Brady Effect" is what make his defenses play out of this world in the playoffs.  Without Brady on the sidelines rallying his troops, the Bucs defense would not have made all those big plays.

Maine, i would like to know more about this "Brady Effect"

Is there a "Marino Effect" or "Manning Effect" that works in the negative direction?  Or was it the lack of a positive "Marino Effect" in Marino's case that prevented him from winning a Super Bowl?  Can a quarterback develop this effect?  Was there something Marino could have done in his career to make his defenses and opponents provide him with the same level of support Brady's defenses and opponents have?

Do other quarterbacks have similar effects but to a slightly lesser degree? (Montana and Bradshaw)

Do other quarterbacks have similar effects but to a much lesser degree, but still enough to win championships? (Every quarterback who has won a Super Bowl)

[dolphins4life]

I've said, for years - and have been openly mocked - Bill is overrated.  I will say it again.  The beginning of the "era" was a Parcells built team.  Bill had teams people don't even remember, like '06 and '08, who lost because of awful coaching decisions.  That '08 team was probably the best team the Pats had. Rex Ryan outcoached the hell out of Hoodie - in New England. Both Super Bowl losses to the Giants are square on the 'Hood.

Don't even get me started with this man's amazingly bizarre draft and free agency decisions, or the times he decides to allow players to walk away, leaving the best player in the game with nothing around him.

Brady covered a lot of sins.  He elevates every aspect of the team; defense, special teams, the line. He makes your running game look better than it is.  He makes your coaches look like mad scientists.  There are reasons Hoodie has almost no successful coaches under his tree. 

Next year in NE will be more of the same; reaching for players who Bill thinks he can get more out of than anyone else (IE, Cam Newton), trying to get more out of less, making bizarre decisions in the draft, having plenty of money to use with the cap and not spending any of it.  None of it will work any longer.  It's crazy how the best player in the game makes you look a lot better that you ever really were.  Patriot fans are about to experience the reason fans in Cleveland, to this day, hate the man.

The 2006 team lost in the AFC Championship game because they were screwed over. (Don't respond with insults, please just watch the freaking game and see for yourself)  They reached the AFC title because of the Brady Effect against SD.  Even though Brady played horrible, throwing three interceptions, he forced the Chargers to make dumb mistake after dumb mistake, allowing the Patriots to win the game.  Belichick did make a bad clock management against the Colts at the end, but they should not have been in that position to begin with.

The 2008 team was the year Brady got hurt.  They went 11-5 that year and had a great offensive season.  Miami just won eleven games that year, too.   

[ArtieChokePhin]

Is there a "Marino Effect" or "Manning Effect" that works in the negative direction?  Or was it the lack of a positive "Marino Effect" in Marino's case that prevented him from winning a Super Bowl? 

There are several things that prevented Marino from winning the Super Bowl but two that stand out to me the most. 

First and foremost was the lack of a good defense.  The Killer B's were getting old when Marino was young.  Then  Shula brought in Olivehead (Tom Olivadotti), who couldn't coach a defense to save his life.  Also Shula the GM was nowhere near as brilliant as Shula the coach.  Although to be fair, Shula the coach routinely won 8-10 games per year, preventing him from getting those top ten picks. 

Second, Marino was a throw first type of guy so they didn't call a lot of running plays, allowing opposing defenses to adjust.  Also, his mobility was below average, so he was very slow in handing off the ball.  By the time the RB got it, the hole that the O-Line opened would already be closed.  I noticed in a lot of preseason games that the running game would look so much better once the backup QB's started playing.  This  became more profund in Marino's later years, especially when JJ was the coach.

[dolphins4life]

There are several things that prevented Marino from winning the Super Bowl but two that stand out to me the most.  

First and foremost was the lack of a good defense.  The Killer B's were getting old when Marino was young.  Then  Shula brought in Olivehead (Tom Olivadotti), who couldn't coach a defense to save his life.  Also Shula the GM was nowhere near as brilliant as Shula the coach.  Although to be fair, Shula the coach routinely won 8-10 games per year, preventing him from getting those top ten picks.  

Second, Marino was a throw first type of guy so they didn't call a lot of running plays, allowing opposing defenses to adjust.  Also, his mobility was below average, so he was very slow in handing off the ball.  By the time the RB got it, the hole that the O-Line opened would already be closed.  I noticed in a lot of preseason games that the running game would look so much better once the backup QB's started playing.  This  became more profund in Marino's later years, especially when JJ was the coach.

Again, was there something Marino could have done, like Brady does, to make his defenses play out of this world?

Marino lost 10 playoff games in his career.  His defense gave up an average of 34.5 points per game in those losses.  Even if you take away the 62-7 Jaguars loss, that's a average of over 31 points per game in his losses.  This was in the pre-2004 NFL era, too.   

Marino simply didn't seem to have the effect on his defenses that Brady has had. 

[dolphins4life]

Clock management is not Andy Reid's strong point

[Dave Gray]

I just want to be on record that you guys are sleeping on Bill Bellichick.  He's one of the best ever, also.

Plenty of coaches have had great QBs that didn't build a dynasty over multiple decades.

Even if Bellichick never wins another game, his legacy is just fine.

[masterfins]

I just want to be on record that you guys are sleeping on Bill Bellichick.  He's one of the best ever, also.

Plenty of coaches have had great QBs that didn't build a dynasty over multiple decades.

Even if Bellichick never wins another game, his legacy is just fine.

I'd agree with you, he is the second best coach of all time.  To be fair last year the Pats had several players that opted out of the season due to Covid so that certainly hurt them.  BUT, things are going to be much harder on the Patriots going forward, as they are on a more level playing field with other teams; keeping in mind the following factors:

1) They don't have a QB, and as good as BB might be he can't make a QB elite.
2) There are some players out there, that after this past season, will believe that it was Brady making them SB contenders every year.
3) Now that they are starting the season as a SB contender, or even a playoff contender, they won't have star athletes wanting to go play there in hopes of getting a SB ring.
4) Both the Bills and Dolphins have finally improved after 15 years, so the Pats won't be entering the season thinking they have 6 wins, or at least 5.

[Downunder Dolphan]

In general, a pretty boring game.

Tom Brady played well and is worthy of praise in general, but he wasn't even close to being the story of the game.  Mahomes scrambled on every single play and there just wasn't offensive protection/great pass rush -- depending on how you look at it.  You held the best offense in the league to 0 TDs.  It was a total beatdown, front to back.

It didn't affect the outcome, because it was so lopsided, but the officiating was not only one-sided, but it was heavy-handed.  There were a lot of big flags and bailouts for calls that might be technically correct by the letter of the law, but not related to what was happening in the play and not evenly called.  Disappointing...not sure if that was homefield advantage, the Brady effect or what....

Halftime -- I didn't love the performance, but it was fine.  I like when they take an artist and let them do their thing, rather than a weird mash-up where they're trying to appease all tastes and age ground.  The Weekend wasn't as good as Bruno Mars, for example, but I'll take that all day over Aerosmith featuring Brittney Spears.

Pretty much sums up my thoughts, one of the most boring Superbowls in the 39 years I have watched them. The game was very dull, the combination of the OL not being able to protect Mahomes & Tampa double covering Hill all game were fatal to the Chiefs hopes, especially when they got behind - along with their own mistakes, they literally could do no right this game. All credit to Brady and Tampa who really did not make a mistake all game, but the short passing and simple hand offs made it a grind to watch - at least it shortened the agony.

The officiating was in short, disgusting, an appropriate end for a season when it was incredibly bad overall. The NFL should be embarrassed just how bad that was. Best crew of the year for the Superbowl? Bullshit. Everyone in the NFL should relearn the PI rules, because honestly I don't think anyone has a clue anymore.

Halftime. Well it's great to have The Weeknd perform, a current artist with a lot of recent hits so the potential was good. He was decent but the sound was not strong though, at times it seemed to be lost a bit in the cavernous stadium - at least his Auto Tune was switched on, unlike Madonna at Eurovision 2019 which was really awful. I'm still wondering what he spent $9M of his own money on? It obviously wasn't the sound system, so I'm guessing maybe hookers and cocaine?

[Phishfan]

The sound doesn't come through the stadium speakers, at least it shouldn't.