COVID and offices

[Fau Teixeira]

I work as a software developer lead at a manufacturer. We make things, all these things are made in the USA. We outsource 0. Which is cool to me, we're well run and we're doing pretty well. There's no COVID triggered work from home debate in a factory .. things are physical, they need building, welders need to weld, stuff like that.

My side however is not physical, I work on software and we've had an interesting time with trying to hire post-covid.  We pay well for the area, so it isn't an issue of compensation. But just yesterday I interviewed a pretty decent candidate and he insisted he would only work at a 100% remote position. We have software / hardware integration points so it's not like you can avoid being at the factory 100% of the time. Today I interviewed another candidate for a different senior leadership position who wants to leave his current job because they won't allow him to work 100% remote.

I'm seeing this 1st hand. qualified candidates are valuing remote work way more than in office work. Even tho our development staff is remote currently and has been for months and is projected to be until maybe sometime in 2022, the fact that we may switch next year into a hybrid model has people turning away from the positions.

I'm sure this is way way waaaaaay more prevalent in software development than other industries, but has anyone else seen this in their work?

[Spider-Dan]

I think you're going to see an increase in work-from-home demands on the labor side.

The necessities of teleworking during COVID have laid bare the lies and hypocrisy of businesses who claimed they "need" to have employees in the office.  People underestimate how much of the employer-employee relationship is not based on a "You are hired to do a job" model, but rather a "You are hired to be working 8 hours a day" model.  It's the same principle that causes employers to have draconian attendance policies: control.  With employees out of the office, that measure of control is lost; workers are judged by their productivity, not by how busy they appear.  And there's nothing more that pisses off an American more than the idea that someone is being paid for goofing off... even if that person is getting more than enough work done during their uptime.

However, like Fau I'm also in the IT industry, and I'm sure he can also attest to the double-edged sword of a telework society: any work that I can do from my house, someone else can do from India at 1/3rd of my salary.

It's a tough needle to thread.

[Phishfan]

I worked from home for about 10 years I estimate. Spider is correct about outsourcing. I'm not in an industry now where much of it can be done from home. I would at least like to be able to log on to run my reports so I could get a couple more hours at the house but the old school mentality at my job would never allow me access outside the office.

[Dolphster]

I think you're going to see an increase in work-from-home demands on the labor side.

The necessities of teleworking during COVID have laid bare the lies and hypocrisy of businesses who claimed they "need" to have employees in the office.  People underestimate how much of the employer-employee relationship is not based on a "You are hired to do a job" model, but rather a "You are hired to be working 8 hours a day" model.  It's the same principle that causes employers to have draconian attendance policies: control.  With employees out of the office, that measure of control is lost; workers are judged by their productivity, not by how busy they appear.  And there's nothing more that pisses off an American more than the idea that someone is being paid for goofing off... even if that person is getting more than enough work done during their uptime.

However, like Fau I'm also in the IT industry, and I'm sure he can also attest to the double-edged sword of a telework society: any work that I can do from my house, someone else can do from India at 1/3rd of my salary.

It's a tough needle to thread.

Totally agree with you on this one.  People who are conscientious workers in the office are going to be conscientious workers at home.  Those who are slackers in the office are going to be slackers at home.  Many employers don't like the the partial loss of control that occurs with telework and they place more of a priority on the appearance of employees being busy than on actual production.  I once worked with a Lt. who was held up by leadership as a shining example to everyone else of what they should aspire to because every day he was the first one in the office and the last to leave every evening.  He would come in early and read the newspaper and he would stay late and work on his Fantasy Football lineup.  But he gave the appearance of being a hard charger who was so dedicated to his job that he spent more time in the office than anyone.  He knew how to play the game and had "Future Commander" written all over him.  lol

[masterfins]

I work as a software developer lead at a manufacturer. We make things, all these things are made in the USA. We outsource 0. Which is cool to me, we're well run and we're doing pretty well. There's no COVID triggered work from home debate in a factory .. things are physical, they need building, welders need to weld, stuff like that.

My side however is not physical, I work on software and we've had an interesting time with trying to hire post-covid.  We pay well for the area, so it isn't an issue of compensation. But just yesterday I interviewed a pretty decent candidate and he insisted he would only work at a 100% remote position. We have software / hardware integration points so it's not like you can avoid being at the factory 100% of the time. Today I interviewed another candidate for a different senior leadership position who wants to leave his current job because they won't allow him to work 100% remote.

I'm seeing this 1st hand. qualified candidates are valuing remote work way more than in office work. Even tho our development staff is remote currently and has been for months and is projected to be until maybe sometime in 2022, the fact that we may switch next year into a hybrid model has people turning away from the positions.

I'm sure this is way way waaaaaay more prevalent in software development than other industries, but has anyone else seen this in their work?

Maybe if your company paid better then they could hire some workers.

[Fau Teixeira]

Maybe if your company paid better then they could hire some workers.

We pay pretty well I think. Above a certain amount, money isn't the only factor in employment decisions. Below that arbitrary amount it for sure is.

[Tenshot13]

Maybe if your company paid better then they could hire some workers.