Capital Hearings

[CF DolFan]

I haven’t seen any actual footage but it sure seems like I’ve seen more crying police today from the Capital Hearings than I’ve seen from any other event. Can someone help me understand what made this “unarmed insurrection” so emotionally disturbing to them?

 I can only think of a few things. 1- They are looking for a payout or settlement for emotional distress 2- They are looking for disability 3- they are getting paid or 4- all of the above.

My uncle who served as a medic in Vietnam just informed me one said it was worse than hitting an IED in Iraq. Oh geez ... they certainly aren't worried about going over the top now are they.

[ArtieChokePhin]

It's clear that they are going after Trump for this.

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

I haven’t seen any actual footage but it sure seems like I’ve seen more crying police today from the Capital Hearings than I’ve seen from any other event. Can someone help me understand what made this “unarmed insurrection” so emotionally disturbing to them?

 I can only think of a few things. 1- They are looking for a payout or settlement for emotional distress 2- They are looking for disability 3- they are getting paid or 4- all of the above.

My uncle who served as a medic in Vietnam just informed me one said it was worse than hitting an IED in Iraq. Oh geez ... they certainly aren't worried about going over the top now are they.

5- It was treason. 

6 - They are being treated worse than returning Vietnam Vets.  They are being spit on not just by ordinary citizens but half of Congress. 

[Dolphster]

5- It was treason. 

6 - They are being treated worse than returning Vietnam Vets.  They are being spit on not just by ordinary citizens but half of Congress. 

Look at you sticking up for law enforcement officers.   

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

Look at you sticking up for law enforcement officers.   

In general I support law enforcement.  I oppose law enforcement that abuses their power and/or use excessive force.  From everything I saw on Jan 6 the capitol police not only didn’t use excess force they used considerably less force than the situation warranted.  I wish all law enforcement was half as restrained in their use of force on a regular basis.  This was in stark contrast with the level of force used by the police on June 1.

[Fau Teixeira]

I haven’t seen any actual footage

When you say you haven't seen any footage? Do you mean that you really haven't seen any footage of what happened Jan 6 ? At all ? Or are you talking about footage during the hearing?

[Dolphster]

In general I support law enforcement. 

Silly me.  I thought maybe you were just sticking up for these specific Capitol police officers because they were testifying against Trump and his deluded minions who stormed the Capitol.  But you have way too much integrity and character to do something like that.   What size "I Back The Blue" t-shirt do you want me to pick up for you?   

[pondwater]

Silly me.  I thought maybe you were just sticking up for these specific Capitol police officers because they were testifying against Trump and his deluded minions who stormed the Capitol.  But you have way too much integrity and character to do something like that.   What size "I Back The Blue" t-shirt do you want me to pick up for you?   

Pick him up a pair of flip flops to go with the shirt, lmao

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

Silly me.  I thought maybe you were just sticking up for these specific Capitol police officers because they were testifying against Trump and his deluded minions who stormed the Capitol.  But you have way too much integrity and character to do something like that.   What size "I Back The Blue" t-shirt do you want me to pick up for you?   

No thanks on the tee shirt.  Those shirts imply supporting the police no matter the circumstances.  I am a bit more selective.  Particularly when I get to view their actions on video and don’t need to rely on someone else’s account. I supported the NYPD in Sept of 01, the Boston PD when they captured the marathon bomber, the capitol on Jan 6, the police rescue teams at surfcity.   I saw what they did — and I approve.  I also saw the video of what they did to Rodney King & George Floyd.  The excess force they used at Layfette park. Their dereliction of duty a Parkland.  Sometimes their actions are commendable and sometime condemnable.  I am neither back the blue nor anti-cop, I judge the individual situation. 

But where do you want me to send your teeshirt reading I support the cops when they kill unarmed blacks but not when they protect our democracy from an attempted coup.   

[Spider-Dan]

Silly me.  I thought maybe you were just sticking up for these specific Capitol police officers because they were testifying against Trump and his deluded minions who stormed the Capitol.  But you have way too much integrity and character to do something like that.   What size "I Back The Blue" t-shirt do you want me to pick up for you?   

While you're at the clothing store, pick up some "Defund The Police" and "ACAB" shirts for the law and order conservatives posting in this thread.  Because they've apparently run out of patience for law enforcement sob stories, and now see them as purely cynical performances!

We can play this "you're just being partisan" game all day.  But implicit in that framing is the idea that January 6th was No Big Deal and this is all just a dog-and-pony show over something that no one should care about.

So... do you think January 6th was a big deal, or not?  Should we even be having an investigation?

[Dolphster]

No thanks on the tee shirt.  Those shirts imply supporting the police no matter the circumstances.  I am a bit more selective.  Particularly when I get to view their actions on video and don’t need to rely on someone else’s account. I supported the NYPD in Sept of 01, the Boston PD when they captured the marathon bomber, the capitol on Jan 6, the police rescue teams at surfcity.   I saw what they did — and I approve.  I also saw the video of what they did to Rodney King & George Floyd.  The excess force they used at Layfette park. Their dereliction of duty a Parkland.  Sometimes their actions are commendable and sometime condemnable.  I am neither back the blue nor anti-cop, I judge the individual situation. 

But where do you want me to send your teeshirt reading I support the cops when they kill unarmed blacks but not when they protect our democracy from an attempted coup.   

I was just busting your balls for some fun and I am actually pleasantly surprised by your take on this whole situation.  Although I still disagree with you on just about every topic, I have noticed that over the years you have become more open to the thoughts of others who aren't in lockstep with your philosophies.  There is little chance that any of us are going to have our philosophies changed by what people on a football forum say/write.  But being willing to at least consider what others say allows us to have good discussions.  And for what it is worth, even though I'm in federal law enforcement, I condemn the same negative things (Rodney King, Parkland, etc) that you do.  I still maintain that the vast majority of cops are good people and committed to doing the right things.  But for those who do not, I want a zero tolerance policy and when they break the laws, I want them punished to the fullest extent of the law. 

[Dolphster]

While you're at the clothing store, pick up some "Defund The Police" and "ACAB" shirts for the law and order conservatives posting in this thread.  Because they've apparently run out of patience for law enforcement sob stories, and now see them as purely cynical performances!

We can play this "you're just being partisan" game all day.  But implicit in that framing is the idea that January 6th was No Big Deal and this is all just a dog-and-pony show over something that no one should care about.

So... do you think January 6th was a big deal, or not?  Should we even be having an investigation?

Spider, you take things way too seriously sometimes.  I was just busting Hoodie's balls about the T-Shirt.  Hence my laughing emoji at the end of my comment to him about the shirt. 

I'm very confused by your comments about "you're just being partisan" game and January 6 being "No Big Deal".    I didn't say either of those things to Hoodie.  In fact, every single time that I have referenced January 6 in here, I have condemned it, ridiculed the yahoos who participated in it, and stated that each and every one of the participants should be charged with whatever appropriate criminal charges that would be applicable.  So please don't associate me with the "January 6 was no big deal" crowd because nothing could be further from the truth.   As for partisanship, other than the people who are 100% apolitical, every person in this country is partisan to one degree or another.  There is nothing wrong with loyalty.  Just as long as it doesn't render someone blind to facts and reason.  Hell, if you read my reply to Hoodie from this morning you will see that I even complimented him on his growth over the years in here and how he has started to be more willing to at least listen to opposing opinions even if he doesn't agree with them.  That is about as far away from your allegation of me playing the "you're just being partisan" game as possible.  And given how many of my discussions with you over the years have included me saying "I understand where you are coming from" or something to that effect and the fact that I ALWAYS consider what you say and don't just argue back, and the general respect that I show towards you even though we disagree, you should know me better by now. 

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

I was just busting your balls for some fun and I am actually pleasantly surprised by your take on this whole situation.  Although I still disagree with you on just about every topic, I have noticed that over the years you have become more open to the thoughts of others who aren't in lockstep with your philosophies.  There is little chance that any of us are going to have our philosophies changed by what people on a football forum say/write.  But being willing to at least consider what others say allows us to have good discussions.  And for what it is worth, even though I'm in federal law enforcement, I condemn the same negative things (Rodney King, Parkland, etc) that you do.  I still maintain that the vast majority of cops are good people and committed to doing the right things.  But for those who do not, I want a zero tolerance policy and when they break the laws, I want them punished to the fullest extent of the law. 

Here is the disconnect.

Lets break police officers into three broad categories.

1. Those who use excessive force.  E,g. Police officers that beat up Rodney King

2. Those that would intervene if another cop was using excessive force.  E.g. the cops that protected Ciomara Garcia.

3. Those that personally wouldn’t use excessive force but won’t intervene when they witness another cop using excessive force.

When the police defenders say most cops are good cops with only a few bad ones, what they are saying only a minority of cops fall into category #1.  When police detractors say there are very few good cops, they are saying only a tiny minority of police are in category #2.

The rub is the absolutely vast majority of cops are in category #3. The difference lies in how we view category #3.

[Dolphster]

Here is the disconnect.

Lets break police officers into three broad categories.

1. Those who use excessive force.  E,g. Police officers that beat up Rodney King

2. Those that would intervene if another cop was using excessive force.  E.g. the cops that protected Ciomara Garcia.

3. Those that personally wouldn’t use excessive force but won’t intervene when they witness another cop using excessive force.

When the police defenders say most cops are good cops with only a few bad ones, what they are saying only a minority of cops fall into category #1.  When police detractors say there are very few good cops, they are saying only a tiny minority of police are in category #2.

The rub is the absolutely vast majority of cops are in category #3. The difference lies in how we view category #3.

I don't have a problem with that comment at all.  #2 and #3 can get a little complicated, but there is no way that anyone who hasn't worked in law enforcement would understand why.  Not going to get into the LONG story, but here is a quick summary of something that happened to me many years ago. I was a young pup Miami cop.  There was an excessive force incident with another officer and to the Department's credit, I was called into Internal Affairs about it within 24 hours.  They asked me what happened and I told them.  I wasn't going to cover for someone who did something really bad.  There were pretty severe repercussions for my telling the truth.  I had a suspect resist arrest violently.  We were rolling around on the ground fighting and he was trying to get my gun out of the holster. I was calling for urgent backup on the radio.  Nobody came.  That was just one of multiple repercussions for what I had done.  It will never be okay for a cop to not intervene when another is using excessive force and it will never be okay for a cop to "cover" for another cop who is using excessive force.  But I can understand it happening when the cop realizes that he could be literally risking his life by "snitching". 

[Fau Teixeira]

I was calling for urgent backup on the radio.  Nobody came.

so would all the cops working that shift with you fall under category 3 or 1 ?