Capital Hearings

[Phishfan]

I have to ask this seriously, how in the middle of a fight for your life does your focus of the situation and your physical altercation allow you the ability to key your mike and make a backup call?  I'm not a trained officer but I don't think I would risk that if the situation was indeed what I thought of as life threatening.

[Dolphster]

I have to ask this seriously, how in the middle of a fight for your life does your focus of the situation and your physical altercation allow you the ability to key your mike and make a backup call?  I'm not a trained officer but I don't think I would risk that if the situation was indeed what I thought of as life threatening.

I didn't want to bore everyone with making the story any longer than it already was, but you ask a valid question.  I had initially asked for a standard backup when the suspect first started tensing up as I was talking to him and displaying the physiological signs that typically indicate that a suspect is going to either take off running or fight.  As we were wrestling on the ground, I reached a point where I was able to use my right hand just briefly enough to key the mic and state that the suspect was fighting me and I needed immediate assistance.  This was before he started to try to get my weapon out of the holster.  But you are right, if I had not been able to key my mic and speak before that point, there was no way that I would have been able to do it once the fight started to become a potentially life threatening level. 

[Dolphster]

so would all the cops working that shift with you fall under category 3 or 1 ?

Bear in mind that this was like 30 years ago so I'm sure a lot of the details have been lost in my memory so I apologize for the vague answer I'm about to give you.  Is your question regarding the initial incident where another officer was using excessive force or the retaliatory action that other officers took towards me?  

The initial incident was a single punch that the officer threw at the suspect after the suspect was cuffed.  The suspect had resisted arrest with violence and they had been throwing down pretty good on each other and the officer had suffered a bloodied face.  Not saying that made his punch after the suspect was cuffed was "okay" by any means, I'm just trying to put it in perspective.  This wasn't someone who had complied and the officer slugged him with no provocation.  I had just rolled up as the fight was ending and the officer was cuffing the suspect and there were no other witnesses.  So it was one punch and I even told the other officer to never put me in the position of seeing him do something like that again.  Keep in mind that society was very different 30 years ago.  

If your question is in regards to the retaliatory action (or inaction) that other officers took towards me, I don't really know which category that would fall into.  It wasn't as if the entire dept did this to me.  There were probably 5 other officers assigned that night to zones within our district that would have been close enough to respond to me.  One of them was legitimately tied up on another call.  So I would say that 4 of them intentionally left me on my own as a direct result of my telling the truth to IA.  There were probably a dozen or so officers within the entire dept. who either made snide comments to me, or were basically just childish towards me for several month.  I don't know which category to place the 4 who intentionally left me in a potentially deadly situation.  I just know that it was shitty and wrong.  Having said all that, I still maintain that through the decades that I have been in the LEO world at one level or another, the vast majority of men and women I have worked with have been dedicated and do their best to do the right thing.  But just like in any profession, there are some who are assholes and some who are downright criminals.  

[Spider-Dan]

I think the worst problem with American police (and maybe more than just in America) is the fact that the "good apples" will go balls-to-the-wall to defend and protect the bad apples.  And if any real good apples try to stand up and do the right thing, they will be putting themselves in physical danger (as Dolphster described).

But fortunately, this dynamic is entirely irrelevant to the January 6 invasion.  Nearly all of what we are discussing is on video, and - save for the seditionists who are trying to make a martyr of Ashli Babbitt - no one is really objecting to the actions of the Capitol police that day.

[Dolphster]

I think the worst problem with American police (and maybe more than just in America) is the fact that the "good apples" will go balls-to-the-wall to defend and protect the bad apples.  And if any real good apples try to stand up and do the right thing, they will be putting themselves in physical danger (as Dolphster described).

But fortunately, this dynamic is entirely irrelevant to the January 6 invasion.  Nearly all of what we are discussing is on video, and - save for the seditionists who are trying to make a martyr of Ashli Babbitt - no one is really objecting to the actions of the Capitol police that day.

Agreed on both of your points.  Although I will say that I think there are greatly varying degrees that "good apples" will defend and protect the "bad apples".   And also greatly varying degrees of the types of misdeeds that others will cover for.  I totally agree with your comment about January 6.

[Dave Gray]

The GOP's take on this is pretty disgusting.  This isn't partisan.

What happened on that day was shameful and horrific.  What is equally shameful and horrific is how we're shaming the officers that were there.

I can't even discuss this intelligently, because it makes me so fucking mad.  I'm horrified that this is our country.  I'm disgusted.

[CF DolFan]

The GOP's take on this is pretty disgusting.  This isn't partisan.

What happened on that day was shameful and horrific.  What is equally shameful and horrific is how we're shaming the officers that were there.

I can't even discuss this intelligently, because it makes me so fucking mad.  I'm horrified that this is our country.  I'm disgusted.

I realize someone locked this but I had to respond to this. How can you be so against unarmed people storming the Capital but don't care about the dozens of riots, looting and taking over of government buildings by the left?

Personally  ... I have no issue with the people who stormed being punished but I just as much think the ones doing the crazy crap last year should be as well. People want to punish Trump for this but ignore the hour long video presented at the Impeachment trial of Democrats doing the same thing.  I guess I just don't get the hypocrisy.

[Dave Gray]

Mod note: I'm unlocking this thread because I think it was locked accidentally.  I don't see anything here that is against forum policy.

[Sunstroke]

 
I guess I just don't get the hypocrisy.

That's because there is no hypocrisy. What you "just don't get" is basic right vs wrong.






(edited to fix quote header)

[Dave Gray]

Firstly, you're attributing me to a position I don't have.  Also, I am not "the left".  I am my own person.

I don't condone looting...never did.  It's wrong and people shouldn't do it.  They should be arrested, if caught, and prosecuted accordingly.  But I recognize that it's inevitable if there's a power imbalance, people will use rioting as a tool to fight oppression.  In addition, the cause that they were fighting for, was just and true.

Also, you may be able to find a quote from a singular democratic politician that doesn't harshly speak out against looting as much as they should, but by and large, those actions were largely repudiated by politicians who supported that cause.

The Capitol riots...I don't actually blame the rioters for storming the building and trying to kill those inside.  If the government was actually being so oppressive as to throw out votes and have a large scale takeover of democracy, I fully expect people who perpetrate that to be pulled from their beds and beheaded in the town square, much like looting, above.  It doesn't make it OK to murder, but it is inevitable.  Let them eat cake, and whatnot.

The Capitol riots are based on a lie.  This is continuing to be perpetrated by those who also play down the severity of an attempt to LITERALLY overthrow the government.  And now, they're slandering the names of individual police that were there, while simultaneously claiming to be the party that supports law and order and police, in general.

If the GOP came out against these riots and treated this seriously, I could attribute this to the wrongdoings of one man.  But this is now being pushed by all but a handful of the Republican party.

And it's awful and gross.  And even your continued use of calling it an "unarmed insurrection" is such bullshit.  They may not have carried guns en masse, but they were armed and violent.

Now you're questioning the motivations of the police that were defending the Capitol building with the testimony.  Fucking gross, man.

[Sunstroke]

The insurrectionist that beat the cop bloody with a flagpole was armed...with a flagpole.

[CF DolFan]

Now you're questioning the motivations of the police that were defending the Capitol building with the testimony.  Fucking gross, man.

LMAo ... Now I have seen some clips. If that's real emotions then I'm an Oscar worthy actor. I'm friends and relatives with not a few, but dozens of police and former military. I know people wiht PTSD and those who have killed themsleves because of it and the problem with all of that is I don't need to know anyone of them to know how fake that was. They asked for a moment of silence for the office r who died from his injuries but in the real world the guy died of natural causes. It's freaking public record. No injuries.

You pretend to walk the middle of the street and make informed decisions but you really seem like your mind was made up before this thing ever happened because the evidence so far has been a joke. You even "justified" the looting and rioting in your rebuke of it. As old Joe would say ... C'mon man!

[ArtieChokePhin]

That's because there is no hypocrisy. What you "just don't get" is basic right vs wrong.

So you're telling me the looting and rioting in the streets during the BLM protests was right?   

[CF DolFan]

So you're telling me the looting and rioting in the streets during the BLM protests was right?   

It was justified because he agrees with their initial argument. hahaha

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

So you're telling me the looting and rioting in the streets during the BLM protests was right?   

They are absolutely and totally irrelevant.  The BLM protests were not an attempt to overthrow the US government.