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Author Topic: The role of the GM.  (Read 914 times)
Dave Gray
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« on: September 28, 2021, 01:42:34 pm »

This is a spinoff idea of the "Fire Chris Grier" thread, but I have bigger ideas that aren't about him or our situation.

Is it fair to blame the GM over the performance of players?

A GM is essentially a hiring manager.  There is some talent evaluation, interviews, and then a big part of the job is getting the most value for picks, trades...maybe salary...not sure exactly.

So, there is credit/blame to be made there.  You can definitely see a guy's talent that fits perfectly with what you're trying to do, so you reach or trade to get him...or you can see a guy who is talented but his skillset might not match with what you need, so you pass on a guy or trade down.  And there has gotta be some level of "gut" for guys, but by and large, isn't this just a total guesswork crapshoot?

I have been in charge of hiring new employees at my company and you go through people and get a feeling, check for red flags, try to ask the right questions to weed people out, but ultimately, you just don't know.  People are their own beings and you just can't predict their performance years from now.

Especially in the NFL -- we're all working from the same information -- you see these guys play in college.  In general, all of these draft boards are more or less the same give or take a few positions.  It just doesn't seem like an accurate job of a guy's picking ability to look at how good the players turned out.  It seems like you're just evaluating who got the luckiest.  People get rich and fizzle out, get lazy, do drugs, get into crime, domestic violence, get injured, or just never adapt...you can bust for 100 different reasons and it's not really fair to pin that stuff on a GM.

Now, that said, there are cases that can be disqualifying, where you draft guys way too high that are obviously not fit for it -- thinking of Tim Tebow -- where they reach rounds higher for a player that doesn't have transferrable skills.  Or when we picked Jamar Fletcher when we had 2 Pro Bowl Corners.  Those cases are more about mismanagement or resources than talent evaluation.  But you could say the same about trading away and losing a bunch of value as opposed to a GM that saves and amasses picks.

I don't know...it's just frustrating because I think we're a bunch of blind idiots trying to find fault in what is essentially guesswork for a large part of it.
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CF DolFan
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« Reply #1 on: September 28, 2021, 01:51:58 pm »

If you're responsible for 1) hiring the coach and 2) selecting the players he is coaching and then if they fail it is your responsibility. For many years Dolphins didn't run this way and everyone pointed fingers. CG selected everyone involved so he has to accept blame for any failure just like he would get credit for their success.

Ozzie Newsome was great at finding players who excelled. Chris Grier .... not so much.
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ArtieChokePhin
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« Reply #2 on: September 28, 2021, 08:14:50 pm »

If you draft a player that turns out to be a bust, and there are several players that you passed over that flourish on other teams,  then it's on you as the GM.

Now if your players don't play well on your team but go to another team, then flourish, it's on your coach
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Dave Gray
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« Reply #3 on: September 29, 2021, 08:38:24 am »

If you draft a player that turns out to be a bust, and there are several players that you passed over that flourish on other teams,  then it's on you as the GM.

Is it, though?  How is a GM supposed to know that one player is good and another isn't when conventional wisdom of everyone is the same?
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ArtieChokePhin
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« Reply #4 on: September 29, 2021, 08:53:21 am »

Is it, though?  How is a GM supposed to know that one player is good and another isn't when conventional wisdom of everyone is the same?

Perfect example.   This team needed pass rush help.   Grier opted to draft Jalean Phillips out of Miami who has been by and large invisible.   His teammate who produced more than him, Greg Rousseau, is terrorizing offensive backfields for the Buffalo Bills
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Dave Gray
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« Reply #5 on: September 29, 2021, 09:37:20 am »

Perfect example.   This team needed pass rush help.   Grier opted to draft Jalean Phillips out of Miami who has been by and large invisible.   His teammate who produced more than him, Greg Rousseau, is terrorizing offensive backfields for the Buffalo Bills

Two points:

1) It's fair, if general consensus that Rousseau was the better player, that you'd criticize Miami for taking a different guy earlier and not hitting....totally fair.  In a one-off situation, who cares, but if this is a trend, by all means, it's on the GM.

But....

2) Can you really say after 3 games when we're a bad team and the Bills are a good team that one guy is going to have a significantly better career than the other?  You're plugging Rousseau into a good team that's already been effective.  You're plugging Phillips into the opposite situation.  I don't know the answer yet, but I think it's just way too early to ask that question.
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CF DolFan
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« Reply #6 on: September 29, 2021, 01:21:27 pm »

I agree it's a tough call but they are the ones evaluating them. Any fan can say this is the popular pick but these guys makes 7 figures to know more than us. Rousseau chose not to play college ball the last year just like Ja'Marr Chase. We dropped and selected Waddle. Chase currently has 4 TDs. Sure I can come up with excuses but if the GM made risky moves or selections they should be held accountable if they don't work.
« Last Edit: September 29, 2021, 01:32:09 pm by CF DolFan » Logged

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