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Author Topic: Watson to the Browns.  (Read 14749 times)
Dave Gray
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« on: March 20, 2022, 05:23:23 pm »

Glad we didn't get caught up in that shitshow.

What a PR disaster.  ...don't want to deal with any of that.
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EDGECRUSHER
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« Reply #1 on: March 20, 2022, 06:26:45 pm »

Miami's alleged offer last year was a lot better than Cleveland's. Texans held on too long and were lucky to get the probable late 1st rounders that they did get.

No suspension for Watson will be coming, they couldn't even get an indictment against him. Gooddell would have to suspend him without any evidence and while he's done it before, just looks extra bad in 2022.
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Downunder Dolphan
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« Reply #2 on: March 21, 2022, 03:16:24 am »

Wow, that's really selling the farm to get him (2022, 2023, 2024 firsts, along with a 2023 third and 2024 fourth rounder - not to mention a staggering, new $230M five year deal which is fully guaranteed).

All for a guy who may not even start for them next year!

Moves like this can make a team, or absolutely break it... As much as the Rams moves this year happened to pay off, this is the sort of gamble that rarely works out.
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EDGECRUSHER
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« Reply #3 on: March 21, 2022, 10:20:29 am »

Wow, that's really selling the farm to get him (2022, 2023, 2024 firsts, along with a 2023 third and 2024 fourth rounder - not to mention a staggering, new $230M five year deal which is fully guaranteed).

All for a guy who may not even start for them next year!

Moves like this can make a team, or absolutely break it... As much as the Rams moves this year happened to pay off, this is the sort of gamble that rarely works out.

Legally speaking, he is in the clear. We spoke about this in another thread but to not even get a grand jury indictment means there isn't even a text message saying "sorry about last night". No evidence except the statements from the women and at this point, they will all settle for $10k and go away. No suspensions coming. I would be willing to bet that at least 17 of the 21 were added on by the attorney to get a quick payday. The alternative is he is the country's most notorious serial rapist and that seems unlikely.

The Browns are in it to win it right now. They have a great QB, just added a great WR and will probably recuperate some draft capital with Mayfield. The team was much better than 8-9 last year, Baker was injured the whole season and dragged them down. To me, they are a Superbowl contender and you make big moves like this to win it all.
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CF DolFan
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« Reply #4 on: March 21, 2022, 10:30:03 am »

Big Ben got 4 (reduced from 6) games after being accussed of sexual misconduct by just 1 woman. Multiply that by 22 and Watson may not see the field for a very long time.  Not sure how you can go less than a year and maybe even more.
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Dave Gray
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« Reply #5 on: March 21, 2022, 10:34:56 am »

I have a weird feeling about stuff like this -- on one hand, Watson is a creep and definitely did some shit.  But at the same time, the NFL isn't a court -- if there aren't charges brought against him, it's kind of a weird situation to suspend him anyway.
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EDGECRUSHER
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« Reply #6 on: March 21, 2022, 10:48:12 am »

Big Ben got 4 (reduced from 6) games after being accussed of sexual misconduct by just 1 woman. Multiply that by 22 and Watson may not see the field for a very long time.  Not sure how you can go less than a year and maybe even more.

The charges against Ben were a lot more credible than the ones against Watson. Like I said, they couldn't even get a grand jury indictment against him and the bar is set obscenely low for that. To save his ego, Goodell may have Watson settle for a game or two, but anything above that will be fought and be very bad PR for the NFL and Roger himself. He has enough to worry about with the Flores lawsuit and the constant shitshow that is Daniel Snyder, probably doesn't want more.
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CF DolFan
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« Reply #7 on: March 21, 2022, 10:48:42 am »

The charges against Ben were a lot more credible than the ones against Watson. Like I said, they couldn't even get a grand jury indictment against him and the bar is set obscenely low for that. To save his ego, Goodell may have Watson settle for a game or two, but anything above that will be fought and be very bad PR for the NFL and Roger himself. He has enough to worry about with the Flores lawsuit and the constant shitshow that is Daniel Snyder, probably doesn't want more.
Credible how? No charges were filed. It was he said-she said which is pretty much what this case is.

It's that whole "violating the league's personal conduct policy" that will get him. I get the jokes that will follow but on the surface the NFL doesn't want people tarnishing their image.
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Dave Gray
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« Reply #8 on: March 21, 2022, 10:51:38 am »

It's that whole "violating the league's personal conduct policy" that will get him. I get the jokes that will follow but on the surface the NFL doesn't want people tarnishing their image.

I totally understand and support this and get it.

But it's just weird -- like, are you going to have a little in-house trial to determine what is credible?  Like, in this case, 22 allegations are credible, but what precedent does it set?  You just start suspending guys who are accused of things without any due process?
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« Reply #9 on: March 21, 2022, 11:23:44 am »

I totally understand and support this and get it.

But it's just weird -- like, are you going to have a little in-house trial to determine what is credible?  Like, in this case, 22 allegations are credible, but what precedent does it set?  You just start suspending guys who are accused of things without any due process?

That is how it's been all along.  Guys who have been charged with crimes have been suspended, only to either have the charges dismissed or go to trial and be acquitted.  Hell, a guy got suspended for the first few games of his NFL career for stuff he did while he was in COLLEGE.  

I agree with you, it has to stop.
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MyGodWearsAHoodie
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« Reply #10 on: March 21, 2022, 11:40:48 am »

This maybe the dumbest deal of all time.

Regardless if you believe the allegations or not….

The Browns gave a guy who has learned that he can get whatever he wants to a fully guaranteed contract.  What happens the next time he throws a temper tantrum?  He also has learned regardless of what he does off field he is untouchable.

And while he is a good player (when he chooses to be) football is a team sport.  The Browns have no ability to build a team around him.  They gave up too many picks to build a team though the draft and too much money to build a team thru FA.

The Vikings giving a 3rd for Randy Moss was brilliant in comparison.
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EDGECRUSHER
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« Reply #11 on: March 21, 2022, 12:07:29 pm »

I totally understand and support this and get it.

But it's just weird -- like, are you going to have a little in-house trial to determine what is credible?  Like, in this case, 22 allegations are credible, but what precedent does it set?  You just start suspending guys who are accused of things without any due process?

This is the fault of the NFLPA, the weakest union in sports. Under no circumstances should a player be suspended just for accusations. It's one thing if the victim declined to press charges even though there is video evidence of a domestic assault, but quite another when it is only accusations.
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EDGECRUSHER
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« Reply #12 on: March 21, 2022, 12:14:58 pm »

This maybe the dumbest deal of all time.

Regardless if you believe the allegations or not….

The Browns gave a guy who has learned that he can get whatever he wants to a fully guaranteed contract.  What happens the next time he throws a temper tantrum?  He also has learned regardless of what he does off field he is untouchable.

And while he is a good player (when he chooses to be) football is a team sport.  The Browns have no ability to build a team around him.  They gave up too many picks to build a team though the draft and too much money to build a team thru FA.

The Vikings giving a 3rd for Randy Moss was brilliant in comparison.

This was a weird situation for everyone involved. Maybe my memory is foggy, but I don't ever remember Watson formally saying "I will never play for you again" because if he did that, the Texans wouldn't have to pay him. To my knowledge, the Texans did pay him all season because he never refused to report to camp. They just held him out for their own reasons, probably so he wouldn't get injured and ruin a trade.

Watson was 100% right to complain about terrible management and coaching and trading away his best WR for peanuts, but he definitely didn't handle it the best he could. Neither did the team, of course. Obviously, they are run poorly and have no idea what they are doing.

When it's all said and done, I think the Browns will be happy with this trade. No one remembers the cost of trades or contracts when you are winning. The Texans will draft a punter with one of these picks and be a perennial 4 win team for the next decade.
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Spider-Dan
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« Reply #13 on: March 21, 2022, 04:05:21 pm »

You should take absolutely nothing from the fact that a grand jury declined to indict.  All that tells you is that the prosecutor tanked the case, full stop.  A prosecutor can get a grand jury indictment any time they feel like it.  That said, there is always a competing interest between "a prosecutor doesn't want to take on a powerful rich person" and "a prosecutor can become famous as the DA who took down [powerful rich person]"; if the DA thinks they have a slam-dunk case, I don't think they'll just turn it away.  So in this case, the DA probably thought the juice wasn't worth the squeeze.  That doesn't really speak to innocence vs. guilt as much as it does effort for results.

In any case, since the criminal window is closed, the NFL's part of this is a self-inflicted wound.  When Goodell decided to get involved and start issuing suspensions based purely on accusations (and not court rulings), he put himself in the position of having to determine which accusations are worse than others.  There needs to be an event - I have no idea what it could be - that pushes the NFL to remove itself from this suspensions-for-accusations game.
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masterfins
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« Reply #14 on: March 21, 2022, 09:07:28 pm »

I could see the NFL rationalizing that he has already sat out a season, as a reason not to suspend him from anymore games.

As for not prosecuting him, it makes it tough on prosecutors to win cases when all the victims are suing for monetary damages - the defense cross examines all the witnesses' and points out that they are all suing for millions and they lose most of their credibility if there aren't any tangible pieces of evidence.
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