The elephant is the room (Roe)

[Spider-Dan]

In the good old days thread Dave as much said his children would not be affected by the outlawing of abortion. He now has a complete turnaround on that position. Nothing about pro choice or pro life. He basically said his family is of means and they could get around the law. Now he has concerns about the law possibly forcing his family in to an unwanted pregnancy.

I think in the pre-MAGA era, many centrists (and even some liberals) thought that an overturned Roe would put us back in the pre-Roe status quo ante.  But new innovations like the TX SB8 tattletale law have made it clear that this will be FAR worse than 1972.  You might have the means to afford an abortion, but when you return home, you'll find a court case waiting for you.

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

BTW Just for those “originalists” who want to go back to 1786. Abortion was legal in all states at the time the constitution was ratified. The first state to limit abortion wasn’t until 1821 and that allowed abortion up until fetal movements were felt.

[stinkfish]

Could that be because there weren’t many Catholics around in the states at that point? Interesting.

[Dave Gray]

Quite a change of attitude from your I got mines quote when you were saying outlawing abortion would not affect your family.

Oh, it won't affect me.  If my daughter gets raped, we take a day trip.

But the idea that the state would try to make us keep a baby and for me to be a grandpa is crazy.

No change in position.

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

Could that be because there weren’t many Catholics around in the states at that point? Interesting.

The majority of Catholics are pro-choice (even though the patriarchy that is in charge is not) the driving force behind the anti-choice is fundamentalist protestants.  Most self-identiting "pro-life" Catholics actually believe as a personal choice it is morally wrong but don't believe the government should be involved.  Which is actually a pro-choice position. 

[Fau Teixeira]

I've seen the misconception before. People will say they are pro life but they don't want to make that decision for anyone else. It's mental gymnastics when you really are pro choice.  Being pro-life for only yourself and allowing everyone else to do what they want is what being pro choice is.

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

I've seen the misconception before. People will say they are pro life but they don't want to make that decision for anyone else. It's mental gymnastics when you really are pro choice.  Being pro-life for only yourself and allowing everyone else to do what they want is what being pro choice is.

It is a major reason why polling data on this issue varies so wildly.  A significantly higher number of people will answer in the affirmative to “do you fell abortions are morally wrong?” then to “do you feel abortions should be illegal?”.

[Dave Gray]

I remember having a long argument with a guy in college who said that "he was pro-life for himself but he didn't care what anyone else did".  It took me a while, but I finally got him to understand that he was pro-choice.