How do you feel about electric vehicles?

[Dave Gray]

I was talking to a friend today and was surprised to hear him say that he's going to die on the hill of a gas engine -- he will never go full electric.

I was just surprised to hear that, as it seems to me that this is where the industry is going and I can't wait to get into an electric car.


I will say, for myself, what is lacking in cars is that I want a very inexpensive "base model" that doesn't have any extra shit.   Like, no seat warmers, computer screens, etc.  I'd even go for manual windows.  Simple, cheap, effective.  Such cars don't exist anymore.

[pondwater]

I was talking to a friend today and was surprised to hear him say that he's going to die on the hill of a gas engine -- he will never go full electric.

I was just surprised to hear that, as it seems to me that this is where the industry is going and I can't wait to get into an electric car.


I will say, for myself, what is lacking in cars is that I want a very inexpensive "base model" that doesn't have any extra shit.   Like, no seat warmers, computer screens, etc.  I'd even go for manual windows.  Simple, cheap, effective.  Such cars don't exist anymore.

I don't see myself going full electric. I'm on my 2nd Toyota hybrid and I think that it's the best of both worlds. I've been contemplating trading the Avalon and moving up to the new Toyota Crown. But I'm in no hurry to do anything.

Even if I did consider a full electric I'd probably wait a good while since I read that Toyota has had a breakthrough on hydrogen engine technology and that they are trying to break into that market. It was only one article I read, so I'm not sure how accurate it was.

[Brian Fein]

I can't wait to go electric.  But they force all those extra features down your throat cause they make money on all of it.  they don't care if you use them, you're gonna pay for it cause you have no choice.

I have had my eye on the F150 Lightning.  I just can't seem to justify the price.

[Dave Gray]

I don't think it's the EVs forcing features.  It's everyone.  They don't sell regular cars anymore.  There just isn't money in them, so they don't manufacture them.

Does anyone in the US sell a small pickup truck?

What is the current equivalent of this truck that was very popular?

[Brian Fein]

I don't think it's the EVs forcing features.  It's everyone.  They don't sell regular cars anymore.  There just isn't money in them, so they don't manufacture them.

I didn't mean to imply this is EV specific.  The dealers make money on seat warmers in all cars.

Does anyone in the US sell a small pickup truck?

What is the current equivalent of this truck that was very popular?

The Ford Maverick, to my knowledge, is the only small pickup on the US market, but even that is still a 4-door cab


They re-introduced the Ford Ranger a few years ago, but even that I'd call a nice mid-size truck.  Its about the size of a crossover SUV

[Spider-Dan]

Cheap, economy EVs like the Leaf and Bolt have been offered; Americans don't want them.  They want expensive luxury EV chariots like Teslas.

Similarly, this is why tiny cheap trucks like the one pictured above no longer exist: there's no market for them.  In America, trucks serve the function of luxury cars, just with a different aesthetic.  There's no meaningful demand for cheap utility trucks.

[masterfins]

IMO all Electric cars are a bit of a waste.  They should have just expanded the Hybrid market that way you use less fossil fuels and greatly increase fuel economy without the need to re-charge all the time.  I wonder what people will think when their car batteries go bad and the cost to replace them is so exorbitant it's better to just scrap the car?  Not to mention the ultimate problem of disposing of the old batteries.  And what will be the cost to the environment for mining the materials needed to make the batteries.  It also annoys me that when you say "electric" people equate that with renewable energy when it's not.  My utility sends out a letter every year indicating the source of the electric it supplies: 90% comes from Gas powered transmission stations and nuclear power plants (about evenly split between the two), 7% comes from hydroelectric plants, and only 3% comes from solar and wind.  Now NYS just signed a law that in a couple years all new home construction and buildings below 5 stories cannot have gas, and must be electric.  As it is this country's electric power grid is antiquated and adding extra load is just dumb; where is the power going to come from?  No one wants to build more nuclear plants (which would actually be the best for the environment), so that means building more gas powered generating plants.

[Spider-Dan]

They should have just expanded the Hybrid market that way you use less fossil fuels and greatly increase fuel economy without the need to re-charge all the time.

There are plug-in hybrid EVs that can use electricity for daily commutes, yet maintain the ability to use gas for longer trips.  I own one.

I wonder what people will think when their car batteries go bad and the cost to replace them is so exorbitant it's better to just scrap the car?

edit: I originally had a much longer response here about the history of the Prius, but without getting too far into the weeds of the battery costs for specific cars (which can vary wildly), suffice it to say that we have been warned about the looming costs of battery replacement since hybrids entered the market, and the facts on the ground have shown that battery replacement costs are not a realistic cause for concern... at least, no more so than engine replacement costs on a traditional car.

Not to mention the ultimate problem of disposing of the old batteries.  And what will be the cost to the environment for mining the materials needed to make the batteries.

The environmental costs of mining for new battery production and disposing of old batteries are nothing compared to the environmental costs of oil production and refinement... to say nothing of the environmental costs of auto exhaust.

It also annoys me that when you say "electric" people equate that with renewable energy when it's not.

It can be if you have solar panels, which I do.  My solar panels generate more than enough renewable energy to drive my car for the year, and owning an EV makes purchasing solar panels significantly more attractive.

[SlothVomit]

EVs just havent reached a point that i would even consider one. For reference I drive a 1500 silverado and enjoy traveling, off roading, back country antics, etc. I have looked into the new EV trucks and they just don't match up for what I need. They haul MASSIVE amounts, actually incredible amounts, but they do not sustain over long periods. If i'm towing a boat 500+ miles, I expect to make it and i haven't seen proof they can do so. Time wise. At least yet. I can imagine they will improve. Charging is a huge issue for me. Currently spending an hour or more to fully charge only to travel 200-300 miles is worth shit. They give estimates on some of these EV trucks at 500 miles i believe, but thats not hauling a family or equipment. Until I can charge under 5-10 minutes and get the same 400 miles my truck can, I will never buy an EV. I'm a purist in terms of big block V8s. Nothing feels better. Smells better. Sounds better. This is where I say we straight piped my buddies truck in high school by ourselves, like only idiot 16 year olds would do. NO REGERTS. NOT ONE LETTER. I have driven the Ford Lightning. It's very neat. Wayyyyyyy to much tech for me. It's just a expensive toy. I completely agree that vehicles need to come back down to more basics. I don't need a large screen, automatic this and that. Manual works fine just fine. It's hard enough to purchase a newer vehicle these days and then looking at the base price of an EV truck, no thanks. I'll die on my hill of fossil fuel and $100 fill ups. For now.

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

EVs are going to continue to improve and at some point  buying a gas car will be the equivalent of my a car with a crank ignition today.

I don't think the biggest fight will be over converting to electric but the removal of the steering wheel.  That is coming too.

[Dave Gray]

I think that combustion engines will just phase out and become too costly to make sense.  They will only exist in an antique capacity.  There just won't be as much demand for an inferior product that costs more.

[pondwater]

I think that combustion engines will just phase out and become too costly to make sense.  They will only exist in an antique capacity.  There just won't be as much demand for an inferior product that costs more.

We'll probably be dead by then. Currently there are pros and cons to each platform. In my opinion, right now there are more pros to combustion vehicles. As it stands, pure EVs are more expensive than their combustion counterparts. That's why I think a hybrid is the best of both worlds. Internal combustion vehicles have over 100 year history and infrastructure in place. It's going to take quite a while for any other platform to catch up.

[fyo]

We'll probably be dead by then. Currently there are pros and cons to each platform. In my opinion, right now there are more pros to combustion vehicles. As it stands, pure EVs are more expensive than their combustion counterparts. That's why I think a hybrid is the best of both worlds. Internal combustion vehicles have over 100 year history and infrastructure in place. It's going to take quite a while for any other platform to catch up.

Sure, as long as we continue to externalize so much of the cost associated with internal combustion engines, like the 400,000 world-wide deaths a year from tailpipe emissions.

[Dave Gray]

Pond, I don't think you're giving enough credit to how fast technology moves once things get adopted.  Things happen fast.

The Wright Brother first flew their plane in 1903.  We landed on the moon 66 years later.