Are we great yet?

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

Well smart guy, they made him kill a fully pregnant mother only to find out she, nor her baby, had TB when they did the autopsy. The government has no idea what they are doing because it's office guys making the decisions and not the farmers. The TB testing procedure is absolutely stupid. It's kind of like when keyboard warriors solve all the problems of the world on a message board but accomplish nothing in real life. hahaha

Clarkson is not a farmer, he certainly is not a veterinarian or expert on how the disease spreads.  He is a TV presenter.  Viewing him as an expert instead of the scientists with PhDs who have spent decades studying the issue is exactly the "kind of like when keyboards warriors solve all the problems"  And that is the MAGA method.  Fauci is a fraud, but RFK Jr. is a medical expert.   The NPS doesn't know how to manage the reflecting pond, but Trump's pool guy does.  Trump know more about war than the generals.   

[CF DolFan]

Clarkson is not a farmer, he certainly is not a veterinarian or expert on how the disease spreads.  He is a TV presenter.  Viewing him as an expert instead of the scientists with PhDs who have spent decades studying the issue is exactly the "kind of like when keyboards warriors solve all the problems"  And that is the MAGA method.  Fauci is a fraud, but RFK Jr. is a medical expert.   The NPS doesn't know how to manage the reflecting pond, but Trump's pool guy does.  Trump know more about war than the generals.   

Have you ever made an argument that wasn't a straw man argument? You change everything to extremes and pretend you are saying something. That is so boring and why I seldom respond to you. Honestly, it's like talking to middle schooler.

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

Have you ever made an argument that wasn't a straw man argument? You change everything to extremes and pretend you are saying something. That is so boring and why I seldom respond to you. Honestly, it's like talking to middle schooler.

That is rich coming from someone who introduced a *UK celebrity farm* to a thread about *Trumps's polices impact on US farms.*  Previously a review of a movie into a gripe about how Christians are being persecuted in the USA.  And another thread about Trump limiting what religious are recognized by the military into defining specifically what should and should not be viewed as Christian.  If there is anyone on this board who likes to divert and create strawman arguments it is you.

    

[Spider-Dan]

Have you ever made an argument that wasn't a straw man argument? You change everything to extremes and pretend you are saying something. That is so boring and why I seldom respond to you. Honestly, it's like talking to middle schooler.

We seem to be trapped in the following cycle:

1) You offer up some claim currently traveling the conservative grievance circuit
2) We refute it, usually by citing actual experts in the relevant field
3) You accuse us of being biased or out of touch while completely ignoring the facts presented against your position

In this particular case, Jeremy Clarkson IS a hobbyist farmer who is far less knowledgeable about bTB (and how to prevent its spread) than the "office guys" making the decisions.

[CF DolFan]

We seem to be trapped in the following cycle:

1) You offer up some claim currently traveling the conservative grievance circuit
2) We refute it, usually by citing actual experts in the relevant field
3) You accuse us of being biased or out of touch while completely ignoring the facts presented against your position

In this particular case, Jeremy Clarkson IS a hobbyist farmer who is far less knowledgeable about bTB (and how to prevent its spread) than the "office guys" making the decisions.

This is what I mean ... arguing semantics is dumb and boring. It was a working farm prior to Clarkson buying it. He retained the services of Howard Pauling, the manager of the farm, until he retired as well. He then hired the top hand, Kaleb Cooper, to manage the farm. Regardless of who owns it, the farm is being run by professional farmers. Kaleb has been working on farms since he was 13 years old, just not in front of cameras. 

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

This is what I mean ... arguing semantics is dumb and boring. It was a working farm prior to Clarkson buying it. He retained the services of Howard Pauling, the manager of the farm, until he retired as well. He then hired the top hand, Kaleb Cooper, to manage the farm. Regardless of who owns it, the farm is being run by professional farmers. Kaleb has been working on farms since he was 13 years old, just not in front of cameras.  

Bullshit.  Prior to this TV show the farm grew a rotation of barley, rapeseed and wheat on a contract basis. If he continued doing that it would be a boring profitable farm.

Rather he buys sheep, cattle, opens a farm stand, gets an act passed in parliament to go around the permitting process, opens a restaurant, he digs a pond, pigs, mushrooms, obscure crops, bees, owls, and a pub.  In just four years.  That is not farming that is a homesteader with severe ADHD and too much money.  No business would be profitable if managed in such a chaotic way.  

It is not semantics to say that Clarkson farm is a less accurate representation of American agriculture than Gilligan's Island is to survive a shipwreck.  

But more importantly the entire introduction of him was nothing more than you purposefully sabotaging the topic of the thread.   Clarkson's TV show has zero relevance on Trump's policies impact on the American farm.  That was  the topic of discussion. 

[Phishfan]

You guys know an awful lot about the farm of someone I have never heard of.

[Sunstroke]

I'm still working on the livestock roster of Old McDonald's farm.


...e-i-e-i-o

[Spider-Dan]

You guys know an awful lot about the farm of someone I have never heard of.

Jeremy Clarkson is a British TV personality that was the longtime host of a popular car show, Top Gear.  Think of someone like Bob Ross (The Joy of Painting), Bill Nye The Science Guy, or Bob Vila (This Old House).

But if you're not a car guy, you would have no reason to know of him.

[Spider-Dan]

It's really simple.   Give those jobs to prison inmates.

I've got some great news for you... our glorious Lords of Capitalism are already on it:

A new constitutional amendment proposed to Congress in June 2023 would remove the exception for prisoners to the U.S. ban on slavery. The effort follows a report from Arizona in December 2022, which found that private firms in the state used over two dozen undocumented migrant workers they could never legally hire but for the fact they were incarcerated by the state Department of Correction, Rehabilitation and Reentry (DCRR).

Though patently hypocritical – Arizona has adopted severe penalties for firms that take it upon themselves to hire undocumented workers – the program is legal under another state law allowing enforced labor of prisoners.

“Using migrant individuals who are unable to work legally here, that seems like just a violation of the law,” explained Arizona State University School of Law Professor Michael Selmi, an employment law and civil rights expert. “If they are migrants who are detained, then it would fall under the prison labor law in Arizona.”

Published by the Arizona Republic, the report counted 26 DCRR prisoners with detainers filed by federal Immigrations and Customs Enforcement (ICE). The detainers render them ineligible for employment in the U.S. Moreover, a 2007 state law makes any potential employer criminally liable for failure to check their work eligibility. But the law exempts employers renting prisoner labor from DCRR or its for-profit subsidiary, Arizona Correctional Industries.

Many Arizona firms have taken advantage of this opportunity, including brands like Hickman’s Egg Farms, Taylor Farms, NatureSweet and Televerde. After hiring DCRR-supplied workers for as little as $4.75 an hour – one-third minimum wage – the firms claimed not to know whether any undocumented workers were among them. DCRR couldn’t say either, though it noted that 10,000 undocumented prisoners are currently working assignments inside state prisons where they are incarcerated.

---

Yes, that is the very same Taylor Farms at the center of the recent cyclospora ("explosive diarrhea") outbreak.

In other words: why pay undocumented immigrants market wages to work farms, when you can pay incarcerated immigrants one-third of minimum wage for the same work?  And then when they finish their "sentence," they are deported.

[Sibster]

I've got some great news for you... our glorious Lords of Capitalism are already on it:

A new constitutional amendment proposed to Congress in June 2023 would remove the exception for prisoners to the U.S. ban on slavery. The effort follows a report from Arizona in December 2022, which found that private firms in the state used over two dozen undocumented migrant workers they could never legally hire but for the fact they were incarcerated by the state Department of Correction, Rehabilitation and Reentry (DCRR).

Though patently hypocritical – Arizona has adopted severe penalties for firms that take it upon themselves to hire undocumented workers – the program is legal under another state law allowing enforced labor of prisoners.

“Using migrant individuals who are unable to work legally here, that seems like just a violation of the law,” explained Arizona State University School of Law Professor Michael Selmi, an employment law and civil rights expert. “If they are migrants who are detained, then it would fall under the prison labor law in Arizona.”

Published by the Arizona Republic, the report counted 26 DCRR prisoners with detainers filed by federal Immigrations and Customs Enforcement (ICE). The detainers render them ineligible for employment in the U.S. Moreover, a 2007 state law makes any potential employer criminally liable for failure to check their work eligibility. But the law exempts employers renting prisoner labor from DCRR or its for-profit subsidiary, Arizona Correctional Industries.

Many Arizona firms have taken advantage of this opportunity, including brands like Hickman’s Egg Farms, Taylor Farms, NatureSweet and Televerde. After hiring DCRR-supplied workers for as little as $4.75 an hour – one-third minimum wage – the firms claimed not to know whether any undocumented workers were among them. DCRR couldn’t say either, though it noted that 10,000 undocumented prisoners are currently working assignments inside state prisons where they are incarcerated.

---

Yes, that is the very same Taylor Farms at the center of the recent cyclospora ("explosive diarrhea") outbreak.

In other words: why pay undocumented immigrants market wages to work farms, when you can pay incarcerated immigrants one-third of minimum wage for the same work?  And then when they finish their "sentence," they are deported.

You break the law, you pay the price.   You break the law as a non-citizen guest in our home, you get kicked out.