Mark Ingram - NFL Combine Today

[Phishfan]

It seems that it is easier to plug in a running back than it is just about any other position. It really depends on what is sitting there at 15 I think. I'd prefer us to beef up our line with more studs, but I just don't know what we will be choosing from at that point. If Ingram looks to be the best guy we probably need to go there. I don't want any reaches with our first pick this year.

[dolfan13]

not advocating for a qb in first round, but this is interesting perspective from salguero through an nfl scout at the combine on qb success relative to draft selection

"generally, those picked in the first round succeed to some degree on an NFL level between 55-60 percent of the time.

Everything after that?

The chances of success drop off the table.

I'm told QBs picked in rounds 2-3 succeed about 20 percent of the time. Everything after that drops into the single digits of success depending on the year. Yes, for every Tom Brady picked 199th overall, there are approximately 91 other guys that never start a game in the NFL."

Read more: http://miamiherald.typepad.com/dolphins_in_depth/2011/02/back-to-work-so-lets-get-to-it-much-has-happened-sincei-was-last-allowed-to-work-by-the-herald-so-lets-do-some-catching.html#ixzz1FHsxTgDF


sure you can find stars at every position in all rounds in the draft, but certain position have significantly better odds than others. qb for example, after round 2, is almost a throw away pick.

[MikeO]

its just a position that you can find guys so easy anywhere, practically off the street.

arian foster was undrafted by the texans in 2009. guys drafted in the top of the draft won't make that much of an appreciable difference at the running back position than guys drafted really late.

at other positions, the differences are huge. the dolphins would be better off getting the best interior offensive lineman on their board than a rb.

YEP!! Someone gets it

[Brian Fein]

THIS IS NOT APPLICABLE TO ALL TEAMS.

I agree with you that LEAGUE WIDE you may be able to find RB's to be successful.  For example, how many years in the late 90's and 2000's did Denver just plug in random jabroni du jour and he would rush for 2000 yards?

The Dolphins aren't that team.

The Dolphins require a highly-skilled RB.  A 6th round guy at RB isn't going to even get a look.  How many 4-7 round RB's have the Dolphins selected?  And how many have panned out?

2008 - Jalen Parmele - 6th round
2008 - Lex Hilliard - 6th round
2007 - Lorenzo Booker - 4th round
2005 - Ronnie Brown - 1st round
2002 - Leonard Henry - 5th round
2001 - Travis Minor - 3rd round

The only guy on that list that had any kind of success is Ronnie Brown.  Wanna know what's different about him?  He was drafted early.

Its not a coincidence.

Let's look at last year's rushing leaders:
Arian Foster - undrafted
Jamaal Charles - 3rd round
Michael Turner - 5th round
Chris Johnson - 1st round
Maurice Jones-Drew - 2nd round
Adrian Peterson - 1st round
Rashard Mendenhall - 1st round
Steven Jackson - 1st round
Ahmad Bradshaw - 7th round
Ray Rice - 2nd round
Peyton Hillis - 7th round
Darren McFadden - 1st round
Cedric Benson - 1st round
LeSean McCoy - 2nd round
Matt Forte - 2nd round

10 out of the top 15 were drafted in rounds 1 and 2.  Not a coincidence.  Only 4 of these guys were picked round 5 or later.

Finding a diamond in the rough IS possible, but its not the norm.  And when you have literally no talent on the interior offensive line, you can't bank on picking a random guy late and hoping he pans out.

[MikeO]

nobody is saying we have to wait till the late rounds or the undrafted group. But we could wait till round 3 or 4 to grab a RB. Taking one at 15 in my opinion is foolish.

The league is set up for the passing game anyway, the days of ball control, run the ball are over and done with. I would rather take a WR at #15 than a RB anyway.

The Packers just won a SB with a group of RB's nobody even heard of in the middle of the season.

[dolfan13]

ronnie brown, the shining example as to why the dolphins desperately need to draft a running back high in the first round.

never mind with the #2 pick in the draft that year, and a black hole at the quarterback position, the dolphins could've drafted probably the greatest qb of his generation... nah, better to draft running backs high. better value...

[Brian Fein]

23 teams passed on Aaron Rodgers that day.

Besides, Dolphins' fans would have run him out of town.  He wouldn't have had 3 years to sit and learn behind a living legend. 

That is the silliest argument I've ever heard. 

You're poo-pooing on Mark Ingram because Aaron Rodgers turned out being good?

Wowsers...

[Sunstroke]

ronnie brown, the shining example as to why the dolphins desperately need to draft a running back high in the first round.

never mind with the #2 pick in the draft that year, and a black hole at the quarterback position, the dolphins could've drafted probably the greatest qb of his generation... nah, better to draft running backs high. better value...

Those hindsight goggles...they only see what you want to see. Instead of Aaron Rodgers, why didn't you use the QB drafted right next to Rodgers in that draft (Jason Campbell) as your example? Why not the QB drafted at #1 right ahead of Ronnie? (Alex Smith)

Oh wait...because those wouldn't be nearly as dramatic as saying Miami missed out on "probably the greatest QB of his generation."

The other two RBs that were drafted in the top-10 in that class were Cedric Benson and Cadillac Williams. Which of those two would you have preferred Miami to draft instead of Ronnie?

You could actually look at that draft class and say that Miami probably got better production from Ronnie Brown than any other player selected in the top-10.

...but that wouldn't support the whole "we shouldn't have drafted Ronnie Brown" as well as the Aaron Rodgers argument did.

[Dolphin-UK]

Those hindsight goggles...they only see what you want to see. Instead of Aaron Rodgers, why didn't you use the QB drafted right next to Rodgers in that draft (Jason Campbell) as your example? Why not the QB drafted at #1 right ahead of Ronnie? (Alex Smith)

Oh wait...because those wouldn't be nearly as dramatic as saying Miami missed out on "probably the greatest QB of his generation."

The other two RBs that were drafted in the top-10 in that class were Cedric Benson and Cadillac Williams. Which of those two would you have preferred Miami to draft instead of Ronnie?

You could actually look at that draft class and say that Miami probably got better production from Ronnie Brown than any other player selected in the top-10.

...but that wouldn't support the whole "we shouldn't have drafted Ronnie Brown" as well as the Aaron Rodgers argument did.

I'm so glad you wrote this so I didn't have to go on a rant, however I'll add, just because a draft pick works out for one team doesn't mean it will work out for another!!!

I'd rather we didn't draft an RB at #15, I think line play rather than talent was the factor behind the stagnant run game this year, however if we take Ingram I don't have an issue with it as long as we commit to the strategy of improving the run game.

In alternative speak, drafting Ingram as a piece of solving our running game puzzle, fine, drafting Ingram because he's the value pick at #15, not fine.

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

The Packers just won a SB with a group of RB's nobody even heard of in the middle of the season.

Patriots won the super bowl three times in four years with a QB drafted in the 6th round.

You can find good players at every position late in the draft.  But overall at every position the better players typically are in the early rounds.   

[dolfan13]

all im saying is that given you can find better players in the early rounds, with some positions thinning out on talent rather quickly, having gaping holes to fill at said positions, and missing a second round pick, running back has to be lower priority.

one of these qb's out of the five or so projected to go early is probably going to turn into a real good starter. that position is significantly more valuable than running back, and the dolphins have plenty of experience with that.

[Sunstroke]

one of these qb's out of the five or so projected to go early is probably going to turn into a real good starter.

Possibly, but maybe not.

If one of them does, the question is "which one?"

[Pappy13]

Does anyone think that Ingram's slow 40 yard time hurt his chances in Miami?  According to Ireland he's looking for a little more speed and excitement.  Someone that can break a run for a long one, something that Ronnie and Ricky can't do.

Personally I think it did.  I think it may have scared Miami off of him.  On the other hand it was a bit of a surprise so maybe it was just a bad run and he'll do better in other workouts.  That would definately change things.

[masterfins]

^^^ 40yd times are over rated.  Quickness in moves, which most believe Ingram has, is more important.  40 yd dash does nothing if you can't move good laterally to find the holes and get past the line of scrimmage.  Not to mention conditioning for playing the entire game, not just the first play when you are fresh determines whether the back will be successful.

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

^^^ 40yd times are over rated.  Quickness in moves, which most believe Ingram has, is more important.  40 yd dash does nothing if you can't move good laterally to find the holes and get past the line of scrimmage.  Not to mention conditioning for playing the entire game, not just the first play when you are fresh determines whether the back will be successful.

agreed.  i care more about the cone drill than the 40.