Homelessness

[Dave Gray]

This is an issue that I find problematic but also interesting.

And I think that there's really no way to fix it because it's just so many broken components at the same time that would need full overhauls.  I don't even know how you curb it.

I think that there are two kinds of homeless -- people who are down on their luck and need assistance or tools to not be homeless.  And then you have people who are not mentally capable of not being homeless.  Even if they had a house, they'd still be homeless.

I guess there's things you do to help a little with all this stuff, but there is no solution that I can see being offered by anyone, me included.  I guess you just try to ease suffering along the way, while not having too much of a danger or eyesore to your city.

[Fau Teixeira]

give everyone a home, that minimizes homelessness as much as is possible

[ArtieChokePhin]

give everyone a home, that minimizes homelessness as much as is possible

With what money??

[CF DolFan]

If you've spent any amount of time around homeless people then it's not hard to understand Dave's point. Many homeless don't have the mental capability to take cae of themselves but there is a third companent as well. I would sat there is also a portion of society that is completley content to be free and homeless.

[Dave Gray]

I would sat there is also a portion of society that is completley content to be free and homeless.

These probably fall into the mentally ill.  I think it's also maybe not the norm.

I think the the biggest number of homeless come down to drugs and alcohol abuse.  So, you can get them a place to sleep, but you can't solve the overarching problem until that issue is addressed.

There are some people that are straight up mentally ill and are always going to have major issues being a part of any organized society.  Still, you can do better -- you can make counseling and medicine available, but it's a different problem.

There are some people down on their luck that don't want to be homeless, but don't have the tools, support system, etc to get back on their feet, take a shower, get employed, have an address, etc.  This is probably the group that is the most helpable.

And then you have the people CF are referring to -- houseless people who aren't necessarily homeless.  Like, Nomads.  But I think they're not a big part of what we're talking about.


I do think there's some merit in Fau's plan on giving a place to live.  There's issues with it, but it's viable and cost effective.  I still dont think it fixes the issue because then you're going to have other issues that need working out, but it would definitely curb the issue.

[MyGodWearsAHoodie]

If you've spent any amount of time around homeless people then it's not hard to understand Dave's point. Many homeless don't have the mental capability to take cae of themselves but there is a third companent as well. I would sat there is also a portion of society that is completley content to be free and homeless.

I know people who are homeless.  And others that were homeless and are not anymore.  None of them mentally ill.  All of them were living paycheck to paycheck and then either got sick or lost their job and missed a few checks and couldn't afford rent. 

I am not saying that there aren't some who are homeless because of mental illness or choice, but 100% of the ones I know it is because the lack of a social safety net.

[Fau Teixeira]

With what money??

Who cares ?

if we can make money up out of thin air to bail out wall street bankers and wage a decade long ware in the middle east, then we can make money up out thin air to house the homeless

[Dave Gray]

I gravedug this thread because I saw an interesting point today that had me rethinking some things.

It was critical of how we look at homelessness by region, rather than as a nationwide problem.

For example, California has a gigantic homeless population, but many of them come from other places, because the weather is nice -- if you were going to be homeless, you'd rather sleep outside in LA than in Minnesota.  But for that same reason of a desirable location, housing there is crazy expensive.  If we battled homelessness from a nationwide level, we could better afford to build free housing in parts of the country that isn't nearly as costly, and also encourage migration to areas that need labor -- where we are now relying on migrants.

I just thought it was an interesting take.

[Spider-Dan]

For example, California has a gigantic homeless population, but many of them come from other places, because the weather is nice -- if you were going to be homeless, you'd rather sleep outside in LA than in Minnesota.

Additionally, there are many examples of regions "solving" their homeless problem by giving homeless people a free one-way ticket to some other area with more robust programs supporting the homeless.

This is yet another example of how liberal areas subsidize their more conservative neighbors by paying for social programs to deal with a problem that conservatives are unwilling to directly address.

[stinkfish]

Makes sense. I was in Hawaii a few years ago and there were A LOT of homeless. Mostly from out of state. Hawaii had started doing was offering those folks a one way ticket back home. What I got from some locals was that people would pack up what they could, buy a one way ticket to Hawaii and hope, or assume, that they could find work and housing out there. Didn’t work out well for a lot of people.

[Phishfan]

The article is about a man being bussed from San Francisco to Indiana. Hardly the picture of liberals picking up anyone's slack.

[CF DolFan]

I gravedug this thread because I saw an interesting point today that had me rethinking some things.

It was critical of how we look at homelessness by region, rather than as a nationwide problem.

For example, California has a gigantic homeless population, but many of them come from other places, because the weather is nice -- if you were going to be homeless, you'd rather sleep outside in LA than in Minnesota.  But for that same reason of a desirable location, housing there is crazy expensive.  If we battled homelessness from a nationwide level, we could better afford to build free housing in parts of the country that isn't nearly as costly, and also encourage migration to areas that need labor -- where we are now relying on migrants.

I just thought it was an interesting take.

I disgree and this is why. If that was the case then Florida would be homeless central and New OYork City would have none. While weather is defienitely hlpful in this attractiion it has much more to do with social policies.

[Phishfan]

We've got our fair share CF. Last time I drove to Daytona I felt like I needed a shower.

Side note, has anyone walked the Vegas strip in daylight? Disgusting.

[Dave Gray]

While weather is defienitely hlpful in this attractiion it has much more to do with social policies.

Maybe, but it's not causation, likely.

If one state feeds the homeless and the other state doesn't, the homeless will migrate there.  It doesn't MAKE more homeless, it just gathers the homeless.  I'm just using that an an example.

Also, Florida has a pretty good amount of homelessness.  We aren't at the top of the list, but there's a ton of it, especially in the big cities.  Miami downtown is just like any other major city. 

Bottom line is that there are desirable places to live in the country, homeless or not -- Florida, New York, California....that's where real estate costs are high, because there's a lot of demand.  So, it's to reason that there'd be lots of homeless there.  Nobody wants to live in Iowa, homeless or not.

[CF DolFan]

We've got our fair share CF. Last time I drove to Daytona I felt like I needed a shower.

Side note, has anyone walked the Vegas strip in daylight? Disgusting.

LOL ... I'm in Daytona all the time and it's no worse than most cities. Daytona used to have a huge influx of teen runaways and as such was a huge place for trafficking and drugs. The police have cleaned up a lot of that. Heck ... the City is trying hard to run many events and people out of town as they want to be a family destination again. Gone are the days of MTV Spring Break. Most of the bigger Bike Week events are held outside of the City of Daytona which was a blessing when they tried to shut it down over covid.

Maybe, but it's not causation, likely.

If one state feeds the homeless and the other state doesn't, the homeless will migrate there.  It doesn't MAKE more homeless, it just gathers the homeless.  I'm just using that an an example.

Also, Florida has a pretty good amount of homelessness.  We aren't at the top of the list, but there's a ton of it, especially in the big cities.  Miami downtown is just like any other major city. 

Bottom line is that there are desirable places to live in the country, homeless or not -- Florida, New York, California....that's where real estate costs are high, because there's a lot of demand.  So, it's to reason that there'd be lots of homeless there.  Nobody wants to live in Iowa, homeless or not.

We have plenty of homeless in Orlando as well but do not have the tent cities that pop up on the streets in places like LA and San Fran. Most of our homeless live in the woods away from the average persons eye excpet at intersections begging for money. I have no idea the numbers but I'd be willing to bet we are much less than California.