Why I am happy about the midterm results

[DenverFinFan]

COVID was going to tank the economy regardless.  The response may have affected the depths of despair, consumer confidence and length of recovery.  ...but there was an economic reality that things were going to, and had to, crash when a disease was keeping people from leaving their homes.

Conversely, we had to supplement the economy with spending to keep things afloat.

And now, we'll have inflation because of it.

All of this was inevitable, to some degree.

Definitely. Had he sad this and been honest he probably wins. Hell may even get a bump if he honestly talks about the hardships and realities to come while doing everything possible to mitigate damages.

[dolphins4life]

Trump couldn't have done anything more to prevent Covid.

It would be the same under Biden

[Dave Gray]

Trump couldn't have done anything more to prevent Covid.

It would be the same under Biden

Legislatively, I don't think Trump was a failure with COVID.  He did pretty much what you could ask.  Is was his messaging to his own people.  A lot of death could be prevented if he had signaled clear and consistent support for getting the vaccine, masking in public, and social distancing/picking your spots.  It probably made the danger last longer and get worse than it needed be.  And it disproportionally killed more people that didn't take it seriously.

Desantis was similar here in Florida.  He didn't do anything particularly terrible with the rules -- he just was dismissive of the things that mitigate it, and his supporters followed suit.

Trump particularly viewed recognition of the pandemic as bad for him personally.  Some people would think that, but they'd have been wrong.  Like I said, a dip in the economy was inevitable.  Because he pointed to the economy as his own creation, its slipping, he felt, would reflect poorly on him.  So, he pretended the pandemic wasn't a big deal.  In the long run, it probably hurt the economy worse than it otherwise would have.

[dolphins4life]

https://www.yahoo.com/news/announcing-2024-bid-presidency-trump-131342183.html

This article, while trying to criticize Trump, actually seems to prove his greatness as president

1) It confirms the economy did boom, and the inflation under Biden has soared (even though Trump did exaggerate).  Just because the boom was higher under other presidents doesn't mean it didn't boom under him.

2) It confirms that Trump did secure our borders while Biden opened them.  440,000 to 2.3 million illegal crossings.  (again, Trump does exaggerate, the numbers).  However, the article clearly shows that he did secure the borders, as he promised to do.

3) It shows that we clearly achieved much greater energy independence.  The author simply criticizes him for exaggerating that we became FULLY energy independent.  We didn't, but we achieved a much greater level of energy independence.

4) It proves he did get money from China, though not to the level he claims.

So in summary, the author of this article claims that Trump did some amazing things as President, but because he exaggerated them, they don't count.    

Economy and Energy

The author of this piece confirms that

- Inflation and gas prices have surged under the Biden administration
- The Strategic Petroleum Reserve has been drained under Biden.  It was much more full under Trump

Immigration and Border Security

The author of this piece confirms that

- Trump instituted hard-line immigration policies that sharply reduced illegal immigration
- Under Biden, illegal immigration has increased by about 4 or 5 times

Foreign Policy

The author of this piece confirms that

- ISIS suffered territorial losses under Trump

The media bias against him is amazing for the all the great work he did as President

[Spider-Dan]

Legislatively, I don't think Trump was a failure with COVID.  He did pretty much what you could ask.  Is was his messaging to his own people.  A lot of death could be prevented if he had signaled clear and consistent support for getting the vaccine, masking in public, and social distancing/picking your spots.  It probably made the danger last longer and get worse than it needed be.  And it disproportionally killed more people that didn't take it seriously.

Hard disagree.

1) He downplayed and politicized the virus, telling the whole country (not just "his people") that it wasn't serious and was a political stunt.  This caused Americans to be resistant to steps like masking, not least because he himself refused to wear one (and said it made the wearer look "weak").
2) His corrupt and incompetent administration actively interfered with attempts to mitigate the virus.  Not only did they NOT help, they seized critical medical supplies so they could resell them to the highest bidder.
3) Trump himself repeatedly interfered with the CDC's efforts to inform the public and set public policy.

Again, there is a reason why the United States of America had the worst COVID response on the planet despite being the wealthiest nation on earth.  It wasn't bad luck or an unhealthy population.  It was rank incompetence and corruption, from the very top.

[dolphins4life]

Hard disagree.

1) He downplayed and politicized the virus, telling the whole country (not just "his people") that it wasn't serious and was a political stunt.  This caused Americans to be resistant to steps like masking, not least because he himself refused to wear one (and said it made the wearer look "weak").
2) His corrupt and incompetent administration actively interfered with attempts to mitigate the virus.  Not only did they NOT help, they seized critical medical supplies so they could resell them to the highest bidder.
3) Trump himself repeatedly interfered with the CDC's efforts to inform the public and set public policy.

Again, there is a reason why the United States of America had the worst COVID response on the planet despite being the wealthiest nation on earth.  It wasn't bad luck or an unhealthy population.  It was rank incompetence and corruption, from the very top.

Not sure how much of that is on him.  Republicans would have not taken the virus seriously anyway, so he had to do what he needed to do to appeal to his base.

Anyway, Spider, I was REALLY looking forward to your commentary on the article I posted, which tries to criticize his policies, but actually shows how effective they were.

Care to answer?

[Spider-Dan]

All of it is on him.  And Republicans would have taken the virus seriously if he had told them to, but even if they wouldn't, he should have done it anyway because it was the correct and moral thing to do.

Your analysis of the article is literally the opposite of what it directly says, so there isn't much to discuss.

[dolphins4life]

All of it is on him.  And Republicans would have taken the virus seriously if he had told them to, but even if they wouldn't, he should have done it anyway because it was the correct and moral thing to do.

Your analysis of the article is literally the opposite of what it directly says, so there isn't much to discuss.

The article shows that he

- Created a booming economy with no inflation
- Secured our borders
- Helped us become energy independence

The article simply says he exaggerates the extent of these accomplishments.

Are you saying he DIDN'T secure our borders?

I will return to the GOP in 2024 if they have stopped disrespecting healthcare workers by then.

Illegal Immigration under Trump:  440,000

Under Biden:  2.3 MILLION

[dolphins4life]

All of it is on him.  And Republicans would have taken the virus seriously if he had told them to, but even if they wouldn't, he should have done it anyway because it was the correct and moral thing to do.

Your analysis of the article is literally the opposite of what it directly says, so there isn't much to discuss.

The article directly says he that he created a booming economy, helped us become more energy independent, and helped secure our borders.  It merely says that Trump exaggerated the scope of these accomplishments.

My case is that they are still great accomplishments that shows how great of a president he was.