Ginn at #9..............the worst pick of the decade?

[Phishfan]

A few thoughts...

* If every QB drafted in the top-10 of round one had to be a perennial pro bowler, the pro bowl would feature 20 QBs every season. Requiring a #9 pick to be a perennial pro bowler, regardless of what position he plays, is asking too much.

Only if their play is deserving. I probably should have stated very plainly that if the Dolphins ever pick a top 10 QB he needs to be a regular Pro Bowler. I forgot your literal use of language.

* If you take a WR in the top-10, rather than a position that could be considered an anchor (QB, DE, OT), he DAMNED WELL better be a difference maker. A TO, a Larry Fitzgerald, a Braylon Edwards. Do you reeeeeally ever see Ginn even approaching that talent level? If your answer is anything other than "no chance," then we'll have to disagree on that one as well. Ginn has the potential to be a decent slot receiver and a very good kick returner, but those positions are ones you take later in the draft. Not in the top-10.

Did I ever say Ginn was the right pick? I just said I thought he was better than Quinn.

* Two reasons that Quinn didn't get under center last season, and none of them have ANYTHING to do with his talent. First one is the nature of rookie QBs...they just don't start in year one very often. Second reason is that he has a pro bowl QB in front of him already.

Time will tell on your first reason and Quinn. Even if he doesn't flop I fully expect once Quinn's career is over many of us will be releived he was not taken at #9 byt the Dolphins.

[Phishfan]

  
     but I highly doubt Ginn will ever be Miami's #1 WR. 
   

This doesn't do much for your credibility since he is currently the #1 receiver on the team.

[Rick]

This doesn't do much for your credibility since he is currently the #1 receiver on the team.

  Where is Ginn listed as the # 1 receiver on Miami's roster?  Camp hasn't even started yet..... Williford will probably be the #1 WR week 1.   WR is one of Miami's weakest positions, so a guy who was picked #9 last year should be the #1 WR week 1 this season. 

[Defense54]

This doesn't do much for your credibility since he is currently the #1 receiver on the team.

Thats not saying much really. I mean Beck is listed as our #1 quarterback.........

[CF DolFan]

  Where is Ginn listed as the # 1 receiver on Miami's roster?  Camp hasn't even started yet..... Williford will probably be the #1 WR week 1.   WR is one of Miami's weakest positions, so a guy who was picked #9 last year should be the #1 WR week 1 this season. 

NFL.com

Dolphins' likely No. 1 receiver improved heading into second season
Associated Press


DAVIE, Fla. -- Ted Ginn Jr. is wiser and healthier as he prepares for his second season with the Miami Dolphins. One thing that hasn't changed, though, is his demeanor.

http://www.nfl.com/news/story;jsessionid=36A5C7E22207DC462905DA18E7ECA218?id=09000d5d808bb415&template=with-video&confirm=true

Miami Herald

(Receivers coach Karl) Dorrell, whose unit was good in his three years as Denver's receivers coach (2000-2002), says ''there is no question the skill is there'' for Ginn to be a legitimate No. 1 receiver. ``He's very smooth, quick, has good feet. He has all the tools to be a great player. He knows he needs to be a bigger factor in what we do.''

The Dolphins won't scale back his punt/kickoff-return duties, and Ginn (34 catches, 420 yards, two TD receptions as a rookie) said juggling those with No. 1 receiver duties isn't too much.
http://www.miamiherald.com/616/story/562329.html

Fox Sports

Latest News
Jun 9, 2008 Source: KFFL Subscribe
News: Dolphins | Ginn likely to be the No. 1 receiver

Impact: The Associated Press reports Miami Dolphins WR Ted Ginn Jr. will likely be the team's No. 1 receiver this season.  
http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/player?statsId=8263

... to name a few.  

He may end up not being the number one once the season starts but right now it is pretty much assumed he is.   Until they post the depth chart during the preseason rumors are all we can go off of.

[CF DolFan]

Thats not saying much really. I mean Beck is listed as our #1 quarterback.........

Actually he is number two on everything I have seen. Most people have McCown as the number one.

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/teamDepthChart?statsId=15

[Dphins4me]

He's an idiot for picking Cam in the first place........

  Yea, I would think hiring the man that was over one of the best O in the NFL was the wrong thing to do.

What does Saban have to do with Cam picking Ginn with the first Pick?

Damn, just damn.  Saban had nothing to do with Cam.  It was about Wayne believing Miami had a quality team, which put Cam in a bad spot to start with.

If the team is as bad as you say wouldn't a better building spot be a QB and not a punt returner?

Who says where that building block for a QB has to come in Rd. 1 or 2?  Would it have made you happier had Miami drafted Beck at No. 9 instead of 40?   

That doesn't make them incorrect either.

Nor  accurate.

 

Talk about a bullshit statement.........We passed on McFadden this year. Does that mean that Mcfadden is not going to be a great RB or can it be that we already have depth at that position?

Talk about not understanding the NFL.  The running back position is not the same as the Qb spot.  First off teams do not pass on QBs who are considered franchise Qbs & second majority of teams do not believe in drafting RB high in Rd. 1 because of the injury concern. 
 

Beck didn't!? How about his age as well?  Marino had questions as well, WTF does that mean?

Beck didn’t what?    See no problem with Becks age.  He was 26 last year.  Three whole years older than Quinn.   Irrelevant. 
Marino?  I thought ever true Miami fan knew he fell because of a drug rumor.  Not quite sure how he relates to this.   Are you saying a team back in  ’83 should have drafted Marino at the No. 2 spot?

Marino was picked # 27 what does that prove?  Tom Brady in the SIXTH round. 

  You tell me, since you brought them into it.  Never did I say Quinn would not be a success, just that coming into the NFL he was judged not to be worthy of a top 20 pick.  Just as Brady was deemed not worthy of being worth a 5th & Marino not being worthy of a top 25 slot.

Because for once ..........for fucks sake just once.........the Fans WANTED IT. It was the safe bet.  You pick Quinn and he fails nobody would have blamed Cam. But you see what happened when he didn't.

 
  Do you really think fans would say “ Well I wanted him also”
 No F-in way.  Fans would start calling them idiots for picking such a bust & saying Cam should have known better.  They would say scouts had major concerns about his accuracy.  Fans NEVER stand up to take blame, plus they would say.  What the hell do I know about drafting players.

Who said he wasn't worthy? Since when is not being in a position of need make you not worthy? Should I piss on Ginn because at least 9 other teams did not want him? How many rounds would he have dropped?

  Who said.  The 21 teams that passed on him & the teams not willing to trade up to draft him.  I’ve said it once, I’ve said it twice.  QB who are considered sure franchise QBs do not fall out of the top 5 much less the top 20.
9 other teams did not want Ginn?  Hmm.  How does that work?   We can only speculate if Ginn would have fallen.  We KNOW Quinn did.

YES I DO. Of course don't make a practice of it, but with your very first pick do the right thing. He didn't , look where he is now.

   
Oh my
Pick the player fans want just to cover your arse.    Talk about not having any balls.  Yeap that is the man I want running my football team.  Get Joe the auto repair man to pick your players.  Great .  Why even hire a coach or Gm.  Just use a newspaper poll to pick your players.  Send that in as a suggestion to the new owner  & maybe he will fire Parcells & Ireland.   Miami Herald can run a poll for fans for each Rd & that can be the Phins draft.  I'm sure if anyone else reads this they will have to be laughing at your comments.

Who You can disagree all you want and claim not to get what I'm saying. 

    I get what you are saying.  I’m just saying the analogies are lame.  I was just being nice about it.

If History is a good judge of character Wayne Huizenga has more patience then any other owner in the History of the NFL.  Ask yourself why did Cameron get booted? The seeds were planted the minute he passed over Quinn. What Quinn becomes does not matter. THAT was the right pick at that time. Its that simple. .

  Cam got booted because Parcells was hired to run the team.  Parcell is a crone type person.  Wayne felt it was time to hire a football guy to make the football decisions.

Quinn was the right pick just because the fans wanted it, not because his talent says he was.

[YoFuggedaboutit]

Cam Cameron had many reasons for being fired, but the whole Ted Ginn draft day issue was the first sign that something was seriously amiss. Obviously, Cameron turned out to be a bad judge of talent, a bad game day coach, a bad strategist, and a bad leader of men....a perfect storm of ineptitude.

And to think there are some members of this board (who will remain nameless), that wanted Cam to stick around because "we can't keep firing coaches."

Cam got booted because Parcells was hired to run the team.  Parcell is a crone type person.  Wayne felt it was time to hire a football guy to make the football decisions.

Cam got fired because he obviously was not a good head coach.  See Doctor D's above statement. 

Quinn was the right pick just because the fans wanted it, not because his talent says he was.

Quinn was the right pick because he FILLED A NEED, and was a position you draft at that spot... not to mention would have given the fans something to hope for.    Regardless of your reasons for not drafting Quinn, a team coming off a 6-10 season has no business drafting a kick returner in the first round. 

 
Do you really think fans would say "Well I wanted him also"
 No F-in way.  Fans would start calling them idiots for picking such a bust & saying Cam should have known better. 

Wrong.  Fans knew we needed a QB that could be developed and eventually take the regins.  They were screaming for Brady Quinn once the #9 pick came around and he was still available. 

And in hindsight the fans were right.  Look what happened to this team this past season.  While we can only speculate what Quinn would've done if he had played, look at Cam's QB decisions..... Daunte Culpepper lit up our defense in week 4.  Meanwhile Trent Green lasted only 5 games, and we threw away a 5th round pick to get him (releasing Culpepper in the process). 

Cam is an idiot and has no business being a head coach in the NFL. 

[DolFan619]

And to think there are some members of this board (who will remain nameless), that wanted Cam to stick around because "we can't keep firing coaches."

Cam got fired because he obviously was not a good head coach.  See Doctor D's above statement. 


Quinn was the right pick because he FILLED A NEED, and was a position you draft at that spot... not to mention would have given the fans something to hope for.    Regardless of your reasons for not drafting Quinn, a team coming off a 6-10 season has no business drafting a kick returner in the first round. 

Wrong.  Fans knew we needed a QB that could be developed and eventually take the regins.  They were screaming for Brady Quinn once the #9 pick came around and he was still available. 

And in hindsight the fans were right.  Look what happened to this team this past season.  While we can only speculate what Quinn would've done if he had played, look at Cam's QB decisions..... Daunte Culpepper lit up our defense in week 4.  Meanwhile Trent Green lasted only 5 games, and we threw away a 5th round pick to get him (releasing Culpepper in the process). 

Cam is an idiot and has no business being a head coach in the NFL. 

  Notice that Dumbte hasn't done squat since that game, and is still without a J-O-B.  I can't believe that such a stupid article has generated this 4 pages.  The sheer notion that suggests Ginn is already a bigger bust than Koren Robinson, is simply idiotic.  While I was unhappy with the selection of Ginn at the time, Ted did put to rest some of my doubts about him coming into last season.  He has a nice set of hands on him, and pretty much catches anything that's thrown to him.  The last time I could say that about a Dolphins WR was O.J. McDuffie.  I'm willing to give Ted ample time to prove his worth in the NFL, but I do expect him too improve upon last season's numbers.  A consistent quarterback would help immensely.  Hopefully, it can be either Beck or Henne.

[CF DolFan]

Trent Green still has a job and Daunte doesn't so if anyone is using the Daunte was a bad decision thing ... they are being unreasonable. The whole NFL sees it but members of internet boards somehow know better.  Had Parcells not taken over this team then I'm betting Cameron would still be coach. No one knows for sure but history would say he would still be here.

[Dphins4me]

And to think there are some members of this board (who will remain nameless), that wanted Cam to stick around because "we can't keep firing coaches."

Why are you not willing to name them?  I’ll stand up & say.  I had no problem with giving the man enough time to turn things around.   Cam would have stayed had Wayne not hired Parcells.

Cam got fired because he obviously was not a good head coach.  See Doctor D's above statement. 

Not obvious.    I have read his statements.  One year is not enough for me to say he is a bad judge of talent.  Beside Cam wasn’t the only one picking the talent.

Quinn was the right pick because he FILLED A NEED, and was a position you draft at that spot... not to mention would have given the fans something to hope for.    Regardless of your reasons for not drafting Quinn, a team coming off a 6-10 season has no business drafting a kick returner in the first round.. 

Just curious.  If Ginn ends up being a great Wr are you still going to refer to him as a KR?  For the record.  I was not a fan of the Ginn pick.  I wanted someone else.  Just no Quinn.  Okoye was who I thought they should have drafted.
 
By what you are saying 4-12 Cleveland was wrong for passing on him at the No. 3 spot last year for Thomas.   QB was a larger need for them & it would have given their fans something to hope for.
You do not draft a player in the top ten just because he is the next highest ranked player at a position of need.  At No. 9 the judged talent of Quinn was deems not of value.  Since he fell to 22 I believe that judgment was correct.  Does not mean Quinn cannot be a quality Qb in the NFL, just that his weaknesses were too great for such a high spot & the amount of cash it would have taken to sign him.  You risk too much money to draft a player you deemed lesser than others.

Wrong.  Fans knew we needed a QB that could be developed and eventually take the regins.  They were screaming for Brady Quinn once the #9 pick came around and he was still available. 

Fans know nothing about his ability.  They only know the hype they read in the paper or shall I say watch on the TV.  They do not know his arm strength, accuracy, intelligence, leadership ability Etc…  They know nothing.

And in hindsight the fans were right.  Look what happened to this team this past season.  While we can only speculate what Quinn would've done if he had played, look at Cam's QB decisions..... Daunte Culpepper lit up our defense in week 4.  Meanwhile Trent Green lasted only 5 games, and we threw away a 5th round pick to get him (releasing Culpepper in the process). 

  Yeap Fans were right.  All that matters is what happened in 2007.  What happens over the next 10-15 years will have no bearing on the decision.
Both players could turn into star players.  Both could be bust.  Both could be average players.  We have to wait to find out & only then will we know who was correct, but it will not be based on the ’07 season.

Cam is an idiot and has no business being a head coach in the NFL.

  Yeap.  That is why he was not hired to run another offense.

[StL FinFan]

Can we just let the Cam thing go?  He's gone.

[Defense54]

Actually he is number two on everything I have seen. Most people have McCown as the number one.

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/teamDepthChart?statsId=15

Depends on who you talk to. Again.........that's not saying much either. 

Being #1 anything on this team is nothing to brag about.

[Defense54]

Can we just let the Cam thing go?  He's gone.

Not until we get a decent starting QB. That draft cut deep bro. I'm just now starting to heal. THANK GOD we got the satisfaction of seeing him kicked to the curb, that definitely helped the closure along. I'm actually excited again . 

[Defense54]

author=Dphins4me    Cam would have stayed had Wayne not hired Parcells.
     

And that is Why Parcells is a winner in this league and Huizenga is not. He's a heck of a business man but he has failed miserably since he entered the NFL.

Fans know nothing about his ability.  They only know the hype they read in the paper or shall I say watch on the TV.  They do not know his arm strength, accuracy, intelligence, leadership ability Etc…  They know nothing.

How the Fuck do you know what people knew about Quinn?  How about every sport analyst, recruiter and Writer that said that Miami was a perfect fit for Quinn? What makes you think you are the only fan that does their homework before a Draft? You must have had to widen the doorway at your home to fit that big ego through the door.