Thigpen's time may be near!

[Landshark]

Is Ray Lucas not available?

I read an article of how he is in constant pain from neck and shoulder injuries sustained while playing football.  After what he did to the Dolphins in the 2002 season, he more than earned that pain.

[fyo]

he more than earned that pain.

Comments like this are asinine beyond belief.

[Doc-phin]

The bottom line is that Henne isn't Vinny and Thigpen isn't Romo nor is he Favre. 

Thanks for reminding me, my brain gets confused sometimes. 

My point is being lost.  Henne is leaving bigger plays on the field.  He has plenty of time to make those reads.  If he continues to do this, we will continue to eek out many games and lose to the playoff caliber teams.  It is very possible that this is coach driven so I am not saying this is Henne's fault.  The thing I find interesting is that we often see the best QB's take shots that the coaches don't endorse and it pays off.  Coaches are often too afraid of things that can go wrong that they choke the life out of a team.  I can see that being the case in Miami right now.  We have plenty of offensive talent and it isn't being taken advantage of to the extent I think it should be.

With that said...  I am not calling for Thigpen to play just yet.  But I like it that we have a guy on the team at that position that is willing to take some shots because our coaches sure as hell aren't teaching it.  I really hope the Henne/Henning pairing evolves, but I don't have a lot of confidence in that.

[Pappy13]

My point is being lost.  Henne is leaving bigger plays on the field.

I know what your point is, I just don't agree with it and I have yet to see any evidence of it.  In fact I think there is plenty of evidence in the last 2 games that Henne has taken plenty of shots down the field and has been very productive passing the ball.  The only negative on Henne the last 2 games has been the interceptions, not that he hasn't been aggressive enough.  So if your point is that Henne doesn't take enough shots down the field, the last 2 games should be encouraging to you, not make you think it's time to put Thigpen in.  Your point is being lost because it doesn't stand up to scrutiny.

You keep trying to make this about the offense, but the fact of the matter is that it's the defense and special teams that have let us down the last 2 games, not the offense.  And while the offense didn't exactly look exciting the first 2 weeks, we won both games.  Forget for a second that's it's Henne and not Thigpen and please explain to me why you think the offense or more specifically the passing game is the problem?

[Doc-phin]

please explain to me why you think the offense or more specifically the passing game is the problem?

I don't think it is THE problem.  It is certainly A big problem.  There are going to be plenty of games that no matter what our defense tries to do they will get scored on.  If we want to be a playoff caliber team, we have to be able to answer that.  Good teams are able to come back in games.  If we get behind late in games, we usually fold and evidence of that is in the way we continue to try to run the ball when we are down in the 4th quarter.  It happened all of last year and it is happening again this year.

The defense is a bunch of new guys, I am going to give them a little bit of a pass right now.  And although they blew a few big plays against the Jets, they overall played pretty well against the Patriots.  So, I totally disagree that our defense is the problem.  Between our running backs fumbling against the Vikings and our turnovers against the Patriots, they have been asked to do more than you would normally expect.

Final note...  Who have been the teams that have had the most success over the last 5 years or so?  It is the teams that can move and score in the passing game!  It isn't like I am just pulling this out of thin air.  Colts, Saints, Patriots, Chargers, hell even the Giants and Steelers had to rely on the passing attack to win.  So great, you want us to run the ball and play good defense and special teams... Wild Card loss here we come!!! YAY!!!  And why does it come down on Henne?  Because you have Ronnie, Ricky, Brandon Marshall, a good slot in Bess, a decent #2 in Hartline and a capable tight end in Fasano with a ton of time to pass and you miss the deep option time after time - come on man! 

How about this.  Tivo the next few games and go back and watch what receivers were open and where the ball went.  I do this on every game and I assure you it isn't going to get you excited.  On top of that, look at the receivers that are open on the opposing teams and look where the ball went and you will see that while nobody is perfect we are behind most of the competition.  Ideally, they would post game film (for a better look) online somewhere around the middle of the week for guys like me that like to keep up with the progress of their team and players.

[Sunstroke]

How about this.  Tivo the next few games and go back and watch what receivers were open and where the ball went.  I do this on every game and I assure you it isn't going to get you excited.

I tivo the Phins games as well (plus a couple more games every Sunday), and unless you have your own private camera at the stadium, all you're seeing is the camera view that's being televised to the masses, which "really" doesn't allow you to see "what every receiver is doing downfield" nearly as much as you make it seem like you're seeing.

[fyo]

(I want me some all-22 action)

[Sunstroke]

(I want me some all-22 action)

Oh yeah, that'd be sweet...but not sure anyone but the league has access to all 22 cameras. I sure can't find any place that lets me access it anyway.

[fyo]

Oh yeah, that'd be sweet...but not sure anyone but the league has access to all 22 cameras. I sure can't find any place that lets me access it anyway.

They were actually talking about opening up a bit and allowing the media to use it in coverage and analysis on a consistent basis before the season. Not sure what (if anything) happened.

What I want is for the digital revolution to finally happen and allow me to switch views (and commentators, preferably) at home. This is the kind of stuff that was "promised" when broadcasts started going digital and it certainly is possible. I was in London several years ago and watched some BBC coverage of Wimbledon. While on the same (digital) channel, I could switch between several of the matches being played at any time.

[Doc-phin]

I tivo the Phins games as well (plus a couple more games every Sunday), and unless you have your own private camera at the stadium, all you're seeing is the camera view that's being televised to the masses, which "really" doesn't allow you to see "what every receiver is doing downfield" nearly as much as you make it seem like you're seeing.

Not sure how you can miss it considering they show a replay on nearly every pass and it is pretty much always a different angle.  Often they show multiple views in each pass play, but rarely on run plays.  Perhaps you are skipping the extra camera angles and going straight to the next play.  Plus you can catch a few things with the ball in the air, once the ball gets there you can't rely on what you see very much because defenders break off of their coverage to make the tackle.  But early in the pass you can see the defensive coverage pretty well.  Depending on what I see, it is not uncommon for me to pause and rewind a play a few times.

However, I too would like to have a full field shot ("all 22") it would take away any of the doubts I have on certain camera shots.

And don't think that I am being hypercritical either.  I only get bothered by the ones that are very obvious and there are plenty.

[Pappy13]

Tivo the next few games and go back and watch what receivers were open and where the ball went.  I do this on every game and I assure you it isn't going to get you excited.

I did exactly that in the game against the Jets and I WAS thrilled with what Henne did.  He had 21 completions of over 10 yards and several big plays in that game.  I wasn't able to do that with this passed game because unfortunately my wife deleted it, I found that out last night when I was going to go back over the game and watch it again to do just what you suggested, but I did look over the play by play and saw that Henne had another 15 completions of over 10 yards, 300 yards and 2 TD's against the Patriots.

During the Patriots game there was 1 play where I thought Henne missed a wide open Anthony Fasano in the middle of the field, but Henne was rolling out to his right and would have had to throw back against the grain which is not always a good idea anyway and that was the only play I saw that stood out in my mind where he missed an open receiver.  I quit watching the game after we had the FG returned for a TD as I knew at that point it was not going to get better, only worse.  Henne is not ready to be Peyton Manning or Drew Brees and get us back into a game after falling behind by a couple TD's especially to a well coached team like the Patriots, if you think Thigpen can do that, I think you're wrong.  The last INT that Henne threw was CLEARLY Marshall's fault as he stopped on the route, Marshall even said as much, how on earth Thigpen would have avoided that INT is beyond comprehension.  When Thigpen did get into the game and tried to make something happen he was picked off, granted it may have been the receivers fault, but those are the same receivers that Henne has to work with.  Perhaps had Henne not thrown the first 2 interceptions in the first half we would have scored on those drives and had a healthy lead going into halftime, but giving up 21 points to start the 2nd half would still have erased any lead we built up.

At this point I don't think there's anything else to discuss, I think we should just agree to disagree

[fyo]

Especially on incompletions, the networks rarely show what's going on downfield. All we get is the quarterback and maybe a receiver wide open WAY after the quarterback has thrown it away / checked down / been sacked.

[CF DolFan]

You can't tell on tv as I have tried over and over. If you think you can then yu are fooling yourself.  You can't see what is happening at the QB and the reciever at the same time unless someone is narrating it or split screening it from the QB angle. If you go to the games then you can clearly see who is and isn't doing their job.

On that note I'm not a big fan of end zones seats but it is very cool to see holes open and close on the lines and just how fast they do it. It's like hockey or soccer ... you just don't get the same view from tv. 

[Doc-phin]

Come on Pappy, this is a blast!  No really, I am fine with giving up on it.  I really don't feel ultra strong about any of it anyway.  I guess I am more hoping others will start to look a little harder.

As far as replays go...  Any non-casual fan would probably love to get some tape on their team and see everything that happens, but I also think they have really done a solid job at giving as many looks at a play as possible in the time between plays.  I truly feel that if you pay good attention, you can see what you need to on a majority of pass plays.

[Landshark]

Comments like this are asinine beyond belief.

And I couldn't care less how asinine you think it is.  Look at the Ring of Dishonor on this site.  Enough said.