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Author Topic: What is the benefit of remaining one country?  (Read 8308 times)
CF DolFan
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« on: January 09, 2020, 11:15:04 am »

Seriously ... what is the benefit of remaining one country? If this country is as divided as it appears then why not split so that each can do their own thing? Personally I think liberals will move into he conservative country as they are currently flocking from liberal states but it doesn't matter. If you want no one to carry a gun, and to kill babies, make everyone gender neutral, support terrorism and unlimited free drugs then why would you want to live with those that do not? Why does everyone want to "make" others live like they want them to?


I swear we should adopt two charters and let states decide which one they want. Then people can move to that state or stay if it suits their needs.

Wouldn't it be much simpler to live with the ones who think like you do and then you can visit the crazy relatives whenever you like ... just like visiting Canada.  
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Dave Gray
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« Reply #1 on: January 09, 2020, 11:39:11 am »

I don't think your question is fairly worded at all and sounds more like troll bait.
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Sunstroke
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« Reply #2 on: January 09, 2020, 12:48:42 pm »

I don't think your question is fairly worded at all and sounds more like troll bait.

Pretty much the way I saw it as well.

One thought on that non-proposal... If Conservative states seceded from the union and had to create for themselves, the top-rated TV show in those states would be old Hee-Haw reruns.

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Fau Teixeira
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« Reply #3 on: January 09, 2020, 01:22:07 pm »

The simple answer is that the conservative states are takers and rely on the liberal state taxes to survive all the while complaining about it. Red america would go broke and devolve into an english speaking mad max style wasteland.
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MyGodWearsAHoodie
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« Reply #4 on: January 09, 2020, 01:47:07 pm »

Problem is that while the country is divided it isn't like there really aren't states where everyone is conservative or liberal.  Even in conservative states at least 40% are liberal and in liberal states at least 40% are conservatives.
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BuccaneerBrad
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« Reply #5 on: January 09, 2020, 02:39:39 pm »

This country is on the brink of another civil war, only this time it will be the Left vs the Right.
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Spider-Dan
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« Reply #6 on: January 09, 2020, 02:43:16 pm »

As a CA resident, I can answer this question:

If we split the country so that liberal states and conservative states no longer have to fight with each other, what then happens to liberal counties in conservative states (and vice versa)?  Why should Miami-Dade, Broward, and Palm Beach counties be forced to remain in the same state as the panhandle counties (potentially in a new super-conservative nation, no less)?  Why should the rural parts of Northern and Central California be required to remain in a liberal socialist republic just because SF and LA want to?

Secession is always just a mechanism for pushing off the frustration of being in the minority to someone else.  There will always be a minority group that is out of power, and secession doesn't solve that.

edit: I mention being a CA resident because for over a decade, we've had libertarians in CA trying to push through a ballot measure to divide CA up into 3-6 states.  It's always a scam for those out of power to push their policy preferences on their neighbors who prefer the current governing philosophy.
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Spider-Dan
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« Reply #7 on: January 09, 2020, 02:50:52 pm »

This country is on the brink of another civil war, only this time it will be the Left vs the Right.
That's what it was last time.
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CF DolFan
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« Reply #8 on: January 10, 2020, 09:02:16 am »

I don't think your question is fairly worded at all and sounds more like troll bait.

It actually wasn't but I can see how you can say that. I'm being dead serious. I know it's been that way for some time but from where I'm sitting it seems like half of congress and the country are always trying to put a stop to whoever is in power. Not that it makes the conservatives any better but I think the last 3 years has been the worst that it has ever been.

Pick a party and it so easy to see the same long term politicians fighting for the exact opposite position depending on who is in power. This just means politics is way more important than actual issues and the only people who win in this case is politicians.

With that said ... the people each is representing do not want to live like the other side so why should they be forced to?

I get that people of both live in both states but if states change people will move. It may take time but it will happen and besides ... there should be plenty of money from the political waste in arguing to "assist" people in relocating. Hell .. in the past people traveled the entire wilderness of a country with much less.  I also don't have an issue of South Florida breaking away form North Florida or California splitting up. Let people live like they want to live.





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fyo
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« Reply #9 on: January 10, 2020, 10:03:49 am »

I get that people of both live in both states but if states change people will move. It may take time but it will happen and besides ... there should be plenty of money from the political waste in arguing to "assist" people in relocating. Hell .. in the past people traveled the entire wilderness of a country with much less.  I also don't have an issue of South Florida breaking away form North Florida or California splitting up. Let people live like they want to live.

It's not like people aren't already free to move from one state to another that better matches their political tendencies, but you don't see that much, so why would it happen if states split up?

I think one thing people tend to forget is that because of the way elections and politics work, the split between democrat and republican (or any two major sides, if you look at other countries) is going to trend towards 50/50. If the population shifted in one direction over a period of time, you can bet that (one way or another) the political block being left behind would shift.

What's different this time around (not that it is historically unique) is that the shifting has been to more polarized positions. You can still have a roughly even split with the "weights" far from the middle. I tend to think this sort of polarization is helped by the two-party, winner-takes-all nature of the election system, but that's not going to change, so it is what it is.
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Dave Gray
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« Reply #10 on: January 10, 2020, 11:27:37 am »

If we did this, I wouldn't move away from Florida, anymore than I'd go move to some socialist country now.  This is my home.
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« Reply #11 on: January 10, 2020, 12:34:13 pm »

I doubt there would be a whole lot of movement.  For all the folks who threatened in 2008 they would leave the country if Obama was elected or in 2016 if Trump very very few actually did.

People don’t move long distances for political reasons, the move for jobs, family, schools or weather. 
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« Reply #12 on: January 10, 2020, 12:43:13 pm »

Naw, the two countries thing wouldn't work out, but California can secede and I'd be more than okay with it.
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Fau Teixeira
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« Reply #13 on: January 10, 2020, 01:05:12 pm »

on a semi related topic, we should add states, DC and PR should absolutely be given statehood
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MyGodWearsAHoodie
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« Reply #14 on: January 10, 2020, 01:08:09 pm »

on a semi related topic, we should add states, DC and PR should absolutely be given statehood

Either that or their residents should be exempt from all federal taxes.  No taxation without representation. 
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